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Post by allthingsoccer on Jul 31, 2016 8:26:40 GMT -5
So the whole idea for so many teams is so that the u12s don't have to travel. Also to have compititive games. I think they missed the boat on this big time. I just don't see it. The fact that we have over 170 players broken into 7 clubs just doesn't warrant high level play every weekend. So why not have some local or near by state DA only tournaments or "showcases"? If there is please let me know. I know Disney has one. This just seems like a not so well thought out plan. Its looking more like a money grab. Just my rant for the season.
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mark
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Post by mark on Jul 31, 2016 9:35:23 GMT -5
Maybe because it's U12.
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Post by Soccerhouse on Jul 31, 2016 19:25:01 GMT -5
The intent was right originality but starting to think DA should just be u16 and u18. The Atlanta United u12 team is going to thrash everyone. They took the best UFA Concorde ssa and Lanier 04d and 05s for sure. And making u12 day 24 kids I heard some of the clubs were scrambling big time to fill their rosters.
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Post by allthingsoccer on Jul 31, 2016 19:55:50 GMT -5
Mark.... Just because they are only U12 doesn't mean they can't play top quality games. This is how players get better. Yes it might be only U12 but they are the future of US soccer.
Soccerhouse... AtlUtd did take some good players no doubt. I think some surprises are going to happen. I heard the same about some Clubs having a hard time finding players. Also heard some didnt. Going to be interesting.
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mark
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Post by mark on Jul 31, 2016 20:16:43 GMT -5
Players at U12 get better for a variety of reasons, playing top quality games is way down the list. But, the greatest trick youth soccer ever played was convincing parents they had to travel farther for better soccer. If you leave your state with 5th and 6th graders, you have a problem.
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Post by rifle on Aug 1, 2016 6:07:39 GMT -5
I think you two are making the same point..
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mark
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Post by mark on Aug 1, 2016 8:37:19 GMT -5
I think you two are making the same point.. Could be, maybe I misunderstood. But my point is that youth soccer has lost the plot. The quality of the soccer that you play must be more important than the quality of the league that you play in. The opposite is the prevailing viewpoint.
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Post by zizou on Aug 1, 2016 8:51:38 GMT -5
I think you two are making the same point.. Could be, maybe I misunderstood. But my point is that youth soccer has lost the plot. The quality of the soccer that you play must be more important than the quality of the league that you play in. The opposite is the prevailing viewpoint. I am not going to argue that players should travel hours to play at U12 (or U16 for that matter), but the reality is that our current system is set up to encourage players do this very thing. If USSF would institute a limit on travel distance to a club that would solve some problems (e.g., your home address must be within an hr of club, with some additional provisos). But USSF would have to commit to a different development system first. That being said, as things currently stand, the quality of the soccer you play is highly correlated with the quality of the league in which you play. This is of course a chicken-egg problem, but this is the reality currently. If they cared to, USSF could stop this craziness and bring better training and therefore better soccer to more players at an earlier age, but they are an elitist and pretty lazy organization (not to mention seemingly a mindless group chasing the current trend, that by the time they institute it is no longer the current trend). The approaches they take in essence take our giant country and make it small.
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Post by mark on Aug 1, 2016 10:11:26 GMT -5
I agree, except it is not USSF. It is US Youth, US Club, and/or whoever is next to join the party. SRPL is perfect example. It is a US Youth thing, nothing to do with USSF. USSF has proven that outside of the national team programs, they have no interest in youth soccer.
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Post by zizou on Aug 1, 2016 10:37:31 GMT -5
I agree, except it is not USSF. It is US Youth, US Club, and/or whoever is next to join the party. SRPL is perfect example. It is a US Youth thing, nothing to do with USSF. USSF has proven that outside of the national team programs, they have no interest in youth soccer. All of those organizations are subordinate to USSF. USSF institutes the policy and those organization will follow like sheep. I don't understand way they feel they need USSF, but they seem to feel they must follow the Federations's directives. The Federation could not stop them from playing soccer; High School Soccer and NCAA are not under USSF, for instance. Every league that is a member organization of USSF, by definition of organization hierarchy, is under influence of USSF.
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Post by soccergator on Aug 1, 2016 10:48:17 GMT -5
The u12 age group last year was a cluster-fu**. A handful of teams played Classic and 2 of the other top teams didn't. This left very few competitive games for the teams that chose not to play classic. One could very easily argue the top 2 teams in this age group last year were UFA and Concorde North --- they only played once all year. But on the flip side UFA played SSA I think it was 7 times. That's insane. Now this year a top team from the non-DA clubs will never play these teams.
Hopefully this year will be used as a learning experience for the u12 age group for future years. Kids want to play games at these ages, one game a week playing half a game isn't a lot of game action. I understand the important time is spent during the week Monday - Friday, but kids are competitive and the top kids thirst for competition. Most importantly to kids games are fun and its where you can implement what you have learned over the weekend.
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mark
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Post by mark on Aug 1, 2016 10:48:26 GMT -5
I agree, except it is not USSF. It is US Youth, US Club, and/or whoever is next to join the party. SRPL is perfect example. It is a US Youth thing, nothing to do with USSF. USSF has proven that outside of the national team programs, they have no interest in youth soccer. All of those organizations are subordinate to USSF. USSF institutes the policy and those organization will follow like sheep. I don't understand way they feel they need USSF, but they seem to feel they must follow the Federations's directives. The Federation could not stop them from playing soccer; High School Soccer and NCAA are not under USSF, for instance. Every league that is a member organization of USSF, by definition of organization hierarchy, is under influence of USSF. You are correct, but concerning youth soccer for the most part, all USSF is doing is collecting fees. They understand and welcome the subordinates doing all the heavy lifting. For example, USSF thought that the Birth Year change was a small administrative change that no one would really notice. USSF has had no reply at all on this issue.
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Post by Soccerhouse on Aug 1, 2016 10:52:03 GMT -5
The mentality for the most part right now is - If the USSF asks a club to jump, the response is how high.........no questions, no feedback, no critical thinking etc.
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mark
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Post by mark on Aug 1, 2016 11:34:17 GMT -5
The u12 age group last year was a cluster-fu**. A handful of teams played Classic and 2 of the other top teams didn't. This left very few competitive games for the teams that chose not to play classic. One could very easily argue the top 2 teams in this age group last year were UFA and Concorde North --- they only played once all year. But on the flip side UFA played SSA I think it was 7 times. That's insane. Now this year a top team from the non-DA clubs will never play these teams. Hopefully this year will be used as a learning experience for the u12 age group for future years. Kids want to play games at these ages, one game a week playing half a game isn't a lot of game action. I understand the important time is spent during the week Monday - Friday, but kids are competitive and the top kids thirst for competition. Most importantly to kids games are fun and its where you can implement what you have learned over the weekend. The problem is that teams just can't schedule a game without it being league based or USYSA/US Club affiliated.
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Post by Soccerhouse on Aug 1, 2016 11:40:35 GMT -5
Yes, now we have a divided age group between DA and non DA. Teams can never play one another, unless they scrimmaged. But keep in mind the non-DA 2004s are playing classic ball and fighting for RPL spots. Next year will be interesting, when all those teams drop back into classic.
I'm not even sure what tourneys the u12 DAs are playing in since it really needs to be DA teams only tourneys. Do they have special tourneys set up for them, at least one I would hope?
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Post by ilove8amgames on Aug 1, 2016 19:41:05 GMT -5
no need to relitigate this issue. top two teams last year were the CF teams. especially by end of the year after playing tough Classic competition. CFN was full of 2003's. CFC lost core of its team to AU.
kids need tough competition. they need to be pushed. top 25 in state are at a different level than rest, not that rest is not very, very good. if top kids need to go out of state, so be it.
steel sharpens steel.
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Post by allthingsoccer on Aug 5, 2016 17:03:11 GMT -5
ilove8amgames.. The CFN team was mixed with half 04's and 03's. Two of the 04's went to AtlUtd as well as two of the 03's. Four 04's are still with CF DA U12. The other are on CF 03 or GA United 03.
I agree that you must play competitive games. All I'm saying is that in the local area with 170 U12 players that isnt going to happen. Already the ATLUTD 04's are traveling next week for some friendly games with CESA and Philly Union. I guess the whole play local doesnt seem to fit during preseason.
The only official U12 (04) DA bracket will be at Disney Showcase this year. Not sure for Spring yet.
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2316
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Post by 2316 on Aug 6, 2016 7:26:23 GMT -5
Regarding U12 DA tournaments, where is the information posted about U12's DA participating in the Disney Showcase? The only divisions are U14/15, U16/17, and U18/19, according to their 2016 tournament rules. There is no reference to DA status in the junior showcase held in November. Just interested in learning more about possible tournaments for the U12 DA group. Thanks
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Post by allthingsoccer on Aug 8, 2016 15:46:21 GMT -5
kallbrew...
Disney hasnt posted the bracket yet. It will be Thanksgiving showcase. They are making a special DA bracket for U12. I would email tournament director for more information. I heard ATLUTD is going to Carolina next week and playing some friendly matches. CESA and Philly Union.
Other than that I have no clue. Don't think that they has a lot for U12. I hoping that Dallas Cup will have a special bracket.
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Post by hateallthesechanges on Aug 9, 2016 6:51:19 GMT -5
The Disney Junior Soccer Showcase tournament director told our club that there will not be a DA division because of the DA rules with not being able to play 3 games in 3 days.
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Post by Soccerhouse on Aug 9, 2016 8:57:31 GMT -5
I think a few of the local u12 DAs are going to Charlotte for some games. I've only heard teams have expressed interest in attending disney jr.
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Post by Futsal Gawdess on Aug 13, 2016 17:16:03 GMT -5
Sorry I have been out of the country most of the summer so this post is in response to a bunch of other posts - sorry
The U12 DA teams going to Disney is not a forgone conclusion. It's entirely up to the individual clubs/teams/coaches. The only thing that clubs have no wiggle room on is the regular season. Other than that the coaches are each individually tasked with determining what is best to do with their teams and players. A few of the teams are heading up to Charlotte this weekend for a showcase. I believe everyone was invited but not all DA teams chose to go. In addition to the local teams going are teams from other regions like Philly. The way the schedule is, non-MLS DA teams will play each other while the MLS DA teams like Atlanta United and Philadelphia Union will play each other. Now from some of the conversations I have had with some in the know that won't always happen. The other thing you also have to realize and I know Coach Money made it abundantly clear at the tryouts at AU, his goals might be contrary to most other DA clubs. His goal is to get players who can hopefully one day make the first team at AU or be able to sell the players rights to another team.
In regards to the U12 DA being worth it, playing tougher opponents, etc. The bottom line is you as a parent need to determine what's best for your child. What is your end game? You don't have to put him into the DA program. He can go and play U13 Classic et.al. The problem is what does he gain from playing against the lesser talented players left who didn't make one of 7 DA clubs in town. In my humble opinion, the more touches you get on the ball, coupled with smart coaching along with better players can only make you better. So I ask again, what is your end game - Professional, College, or just fun. Based off of that determination, you work backwards.
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Post by allthingsoccer on Aug 15, 2016 17:52:33 GMT -5
Hey Futsal Gawdess
For the U12 DA, the moment you sign the agreement you can not play any organized soccer without written permission from US Soccer. You can't play more than one game a day unless the halves are shortened. That's why most DA tournaments are showcase. 1 game a day.
Very interesting that MLS DA only playing MLS DA teams. I guess they are still working hard on creating own MLS only league.
Disney will most likely have a DA bracket but it will be very limited on the accepted teams and it will be a showcase. 1 game a day with no winners. (Friendly)
I'm down for touches but just feel that with 170+ kids in local area playing U12 DA the games are going to be that of SuperY 7-0, 8-0 etc.. I would say only 6 out of the 17 teams will be close. The rest...who knows.
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Post by Soccerhouse on Aug 15, 2016 19:08:53 GMT -5
1 game a day at that age and a 7 hour trip ain't worth it for the clubs that have to pay there way down there. Most teams will have 4 subs, they can easily play 2 games a day on some of those tiny fields.
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Post by Futsal Gawdess on Aug 15, 2016 22:12:30 GMT -5
Actually this upcoming weekend it is going to be two games on both days, so each player should be playing 4 games this Saturday and Sunday.
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2316
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Post by 2316 on Aug 16, 2016 7:16:22 GMT -5
What clubs are participating in the U12 DA matches this weekend in Charlotte?
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