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Post by soccergator on Oct 2, 2017 8:30:30 GMT -5
So I'll admit, I missed the first half of the UGA - Gator game last night. Turned it on for the 2nd half at 0-0, and it was a freaking clinic. Florida looked like Barcleona and kept the ball on the surface and played a really nice style of soccer. I'm not sure if Georgia even really touched the ball in the 2nd. Gators picked up 3 goals, but really their style of play completely overwhelmed the dawgs.
Being a gator fan, it sure was fun to watch. The gators really do play a nice style of soccer, and the freshman Deanne Rose from Canada is going to be a baller!
Do top players in this state not even consider the dawgs? Is that the problem?? given the quality of girls soccer in this state, UGA should and could be loaded with local talent -- why aren't they? I keep hearing all these top players - Stanford, Notre DAme, Duke, UNC, Virginia etc, havent' heard much about the dawgs. They did show a stat that they were a young team.
By the way, I loved Florida's substation patterns, she was bringing girls in an out of the bench all half, maybe that was the biggest difference, keeping girls fresh in the 2nd half. Florida has a juco, which is extremely rare -- Lais Araujo, she played 34 minutes off the bench, but man she can play. Watch out for her, she was the captain of Brazils 2016 world cup u20 team.
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Post by soccerfan30 on Oct 2, 2017 8:37:36 GMT -5
I would suspect its due to coaching vs the quality of the players. KB played at TH and is very good, MB played at Holy Innocents and set the school career scoring record. The talent is there but I assume its the coaching/training. Most D1 schools on the girls side recruit athletes and play direct.
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Post by zizou on Oct 2, 2017 9:54:30 GMT -5
I would disagree with talent being there. UGA do not pass the eye test. Go to these games and look at their players versus players for Clemson or Florida. The differences in athleticism and soccer technical ability are shocking. These players are not of sufficient caliber on either of those fronts to compete in any top soccer conference in the country.
Now, good coaching can cover for deficiencies. Last night was an example of how poorly coached UGA are. The UGA staff set their team up for failure and the debacle that occurred in the second half. UGA came out blazing, playing the first 25 minutes like their hair was on fire. They actually kept the Gators under tremendous pressure, generated a few good chances, but on only one occasion did I think they were a risk to score. They have no recognizable style of play. Oh, I am sure they would tell us they are some sort of "possession" team, but that would be a farce. They started to wear down and they had no style of play on which to depend to help them get through the game. Florida gradually took control. Gators have way better players, but they are also more fit and way more athletic. Recruiting subpar players of insufficient athleticism for Power 5 soccer is totally on the coaching staff. You can say what you want about how these players performed in High School or at the Club level, but that out there at the top of women's college soccer is a different deal.
Also to be fair, I think UGA is now something like 1-29-2 all time against Florida! Shocking. So UGA struggles against Gators are not a new thing. Nevertheless, the AD made a terrible decision with this last hire. SH was way way better than this guy they put in charge. It is obvious. Having BM as an assistant was a questionable move. Sure, it is okay if you want to have some sort of provincial approach to top level women's college soccer, but not if you want to compete at the very highest level. The AD had a top level Head Coach in a Power 5 conference at his disposal, someone who would have taken the job, and happens to live in Athens, and he hired this group instead. What a disaster. A guy who finished second in the PAC-12 at Washington State. His teams would have wiped the floor with UGA. Instead he hires a life long assistant coach.
Well, let's see how UGA finishes the year. The current staff is 6-19 in the SEC over 2.5 seasons. I do not see that record improving. They have already demonstrated they don't have an eye for SEC caliber talent. I hope they turn it around. I want a winner here. But the signs do not look good.
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Post by soccergator on Oct 2, 2017 10:12:05 GMT -5
There is no question, we questioned the hire immediately. It clearly isn't working. Damn, pissed I missed the first half, but that's why they play 80 minutes. floridagators.com/documents/2017/10/1//10_1_17_Box_Score.pdfThere is no question the florida players were more composed on the ball and were dangerous.
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Post by Futsal Gawdess on Oct 2, 2017 10:43:21 GMT -5
Not sure about the SEC but given a choice, I would send my daughter to play in the ACC or PAC 10/12. I don't know of the SEC having perennial powerhouse teams.
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Post by zizou on Oct 2, 2017 10:57:11 GMT -5
Not sure about the SEC but given a choice, I would send my daughter to play in the ACC or PAC 10/12. I don't know of the SEC having perennial powerhouse teams. In general I would agree with you, but right now SEC have more teams in RPI top 25 than any other conference in the country, including the top team (South Carolina). Time passes, things change. I actually like the way quite a few Big Ten teams play (Northwestern, Purdue, Michigan, Minnesota). They keep the ball on the deck, make interesting runs, get in good positions to offer support, don't just run around like they are wild animals. This is true except for Indiana who play some of the ugliest soccer out there. Ironically, their coach is a former Hatter. She also says Indiana are a "possession team." I think these coaches assume if they say things often enough it will magically come true (just like politicians).
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Post by Soccerhouse on Oct 3, 2017 11:33:32 GMT -5
Definitely much more distribution of wealth in the women's college game then years before. Not sure what the measuring stick is for a successful womens program, because the reality is its a small list of schools that have won the national championship. I would think that of any major college sports, its probably the shortest list of all.
Florida damn looks the part thought. I think they play possession soccer to a fault though, because when they do get down, they really don't have that sense of urgency and still are patient. granted the last few years, they forced alot through savanah jordan, but I don't blame them, girl could flat our score.
My guess is if you took the top youth local Georgia players vs florida players annually, Georgia would win by a few goals every year. Its similar to the dawgs/gators or texas not being good in football, its just not acceptable given the level of talent in these states.
Any good coach will tell you, their number one priority is recruit your own backyard, you have to keep your local best players you cannot constantly let them leave the state. Look this isn't the UGA of the 80's and 90s, its now one of the best public schools in the country. Is it Stanford, UVA, or Duke -- no, but its a damn good school, and its a beautiful place to spend 4 or 5 years.
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Post by fridge on Oct 3, 2017 12:04:22 GMT -5
Intriguing question. This staff finally got its first recruits on the field this year. However, they are only freshman. They clearly brought in some high caliber ECNL kids from TH, Jax, PDA, and CF. The staff clearly believes the cupboard was bare given all the freshman playing. They have a walk on ECNL center mid playing 90 minutes at outside back. She is doing good and is a good/hard working player, but this suggests no confidence in the last coach's players. And, given the last coach's record, the current staff has an argument. It seems like they are going to go hard with a young team and hopefully figure it out over the next couple of years.
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Post by zizou on Oct 4, 2017 12:22:58 GMT -5
I can tell this is an important and sensitive topic to some people. It is not the case that the cupboard was bare when Holeman left, although it is true that when his best players saw the new hire they left the UGA program. The current team is mostly seniors and freshman (about even numbers) with maybe 8-10 sophomores/juniors. They are not all young.
In Holeman's last year at UGA the team lost in the first round of the NCAA tournament (that means they made it to the NCAA tournament). They finished 10-8-2 in his last year in Athens and were 5-5-1 in SEC play. By comparison, in the 2.5 seasons, the current staff is 6-19-0 in SEC play.
Also, from Holeman's Bio on the Lamar webpage (where he is currently head coach): Holeman's career has been spent in the Southeastern Conference, including two programs he started from the ground up....
...five seasons in Athens, Ga., where he recorded a 53-39-11 (.568) overall record, and guided the Bulldogs to two NCAA tournament appearances. During his time with the Bulldogs, he guided Georgia to four 10-win seasons, four top-50 RPI rankings – including a No. 14 national ranking in 2014, coached 14 All-SEC selections, 10 all-region honorees and one All-American. Holeman's athletes also got the job done in the classroom earning 54 SEC Academic Honor Roll selections. Holeman closed out his time in Georgia by bringing in two of the nation's top recruiting classes. His 2013 signing class was ranked 10th nationally, and he followed that up by bringing in nation's 11th-best class (tops in the SEC) the very next season.
Holeman took the job at Georgia after 16 seasons at Mississippi where he was the first soccer coach in Rebels' history. During his time in Oxford, the Rebels posted a 158-119-28 (.564) overall record, which included four NCAA Championship appearances and three SEC Western Division titles. Ole Miss made 13-straight SEC tournament appearances under Holeman's guidance and had 30 players named all-conference, including two freshmen of the year. During his final five seasons at Ole Miss, Holeman posted a 19-1-5 (.860) record against SEC West Division foes, and recorded the league's fourth-best winning percentage (in SEC only games) during that time. By any measure that is a pretty good career. And he is still pretty young. The point here is that this coaching staff has yet to demonstrate anything resembling that level of success. And Holeman's staff could recognize and recruit top level talent. I am not saying they did not make mistakes, but they could tell when a player at least had the technical ability and athleticism to compete at the highest level of NCAA D1 women's soccer. The cupboard was not bare. Look at the recruiting rankings. I never went to a match during Holeman's tenure and thought the players were overmatched technically and athletically. I think that every time I go over to our beautiful soccer complex now. I was not always happy with how Holeman's teams played, but after seeing what the current staff is running out there I long for the old days (of three years ago!). I hope things turn around, but the available evidence indicates UGA screwed up on this hire. But I am hoping this is just part of a VERY SHALLOW learning curve.
By the way, Lamar is 9-3-1 right now in Holeman's second season (with a fraction of the resources as UGA and after the city was leveled by a hurricane!) and has an RPI of 91; Georgia has an RPI of 88.
The current staff, at least as of now, cannot get the best players from the ATL; they are playing for other teams and going to the College Cup with other universities. Others of them are playing for/committing to North Carolina, Clemson, Stanford, Duke, Texas A&M, South Carolina, Auburn, Tennessee, etc. I am not saying this to be insensitive. This is just a fact.
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Post by fridge on Oct 5, 2017 7:38:06 GMT -5
Man, you countered with FACTS. I didn't realize Holman made the tournament in 2014. So, why did he get the boot? The only thing I will add as you make some very solid points, is you concede the team on the field doesn't look great. But, they are still playing with mostly Holman's players. I see more technical issues with the team rather than tactical issues. The current coach is from Duke. His DNA is to possess. If you have even 1 weak link who has a bad touch, can't move the ball quickly, makes a poor decision, etc., that style of play doesn't work. If he can survive, we will know in about 2 years because his recruits will be fresh, soph and jr.
Good discussion.
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Post by Soccerhouse on Oct 5, 2017 9:31:05 GMT -5
There is absolutely no reason that UGA can't and shouldn't be a top 3 program in the SEC.
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Post by Keeper on Oct 5, 2017 15:19:58 GMT -5
There is absolutely no reason that UGA can't and shouldn't be a top 3 program in the SEC. Other then the fact they are uga, and what smart person would go there? #THWG 😉
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Post by paterfamilias on Oct 5, 2017 17:18:09 GMT -5
Idk.... Can the smart girls play varsity soccer at Tech?
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Post by zizou on Oct 5, 2017 22:32:52 GMT -5
Make that 6-20-0
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Post by Soccerhouse on Oct 6, 2017 8:03:08 GMT -5
He has them right where he wants them to make an impressive run the last 5 games-- right at the bottom of the league, dead last.... ouch 0-5-0 with zero points..... www.secsports.com/standings/soccer
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Post by zizou on Oct 8, 2017 19:43:41 GMT -5
Make that 6-21-0 and 0-6-0 this year.
I will say UGA battled aTm but they lost to the better team. UGA did have chances and played as hard as they could I think. aTm were without their top goal scorer who I think was injured the day before they traveled to Athens, and this had been their 4th match in 10 days (brutal); UGA had played 3 over that span (still not easy). Regardless, clear once again who was more skilled, more fit, and had the higher soccer IQ.
By the way, so far this year: UGA best win is against High Point (1-0) in Athens. High Point has RPI something like 150. High Point! Their worst loss was against Missouri (1-3) in Columbia. Missouri has RPI of something like 135.
High Point is a beautiful campus. They make the kids steaks once a week. Do their laundry. Good academics. Looks like a country club. Have a kid interested in High Point. Don't blame her. But I don't care how many young players UGA are playing, the basis of comparison for UGA women's soccer should be a bit north of High Point. But that is where we are.
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Post by soccerworld on Oct 9, 2017 9:13:08 GMT -5
Ouch - the only team in the league without a point and probably the state with the best local girls soccer teams and programs.
From the following conferences - only UGA, Miami, ECU and Oregon don’t have a point in conference play!
Big East Big 10 Big 12 ACC PAC 12 SEC AAC
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Post by zizou on Oct 13, 2017 20:52:17 GMT -5
Make that 6-22-0 and 0-7-0 this year.
Totally worked by Tennessee 4-0. They had no hope of handling Bunny Shaw who had a brace. This team has no fight, shows no heart. Totally dominated. Still no athletes, no fitness, little skill, and very low soccer IQ. Quite clear these coaches are out of their depth. We predicted this when BL was hired. Then he made bonehead move of hiring aptly named BM. If Administration does not do something fast UGA soccer will be in a place from which it will be very hard to recover.
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Post by spectator on Oct 14, 2017 21:45:13 GMT -5
Make that 6-21-0 and 0-6-0 this year. I will say UGA battled aTm but they lost to the better team. UGA did have chances and played as hard as they could I think. aTm were without their top goal scorer who I think was injured the day before they traveled to Athens, and this had been their 4th match in 10 days (brutal); UGA had played 3 over that span (still not easy). Regardless, clear once again who was more skilled, more fit, and had the higher soccer IQ. By the way, so far this year: UGA best win is against High Point (1-0) in Athens. High Point has RPI something like 150. High Point! Their worst loss was against Missouri (1-3) in Columbia. Missouri has RPI of something like 135. High Point is a beautiful campus. They make the kids steaks once a week. Do their laundry. Good academics. Looks like a country club. Have a kid interested in High Point. Don't blame her. But I don't care how many young players UGA are playing, the basis of comparison for UGA women's soccer should be a bit north of High Point. But that is where we are. I'd like to see a match between UGA and North Georgia - or Columbus State. Two strong D2 schools that pull local talent and have highly successful programs. As for High Point, yes, gorgeous campus and outstanding academics. Their president has done wonders for the school with endowments and student involvement. Definitely worth considering - for those two things alone if not the soccer program potential in years to come
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Post by Soccerhouse on Oct 19, 2017 20:01:44 GMT -5
Make that 0-8-0
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Post by zizou on Oct 19, 2017 21:56:31 GMT -5
The results of this experiment by the oh so knowledgeable UGA Athletics department are now in. Time to move on.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 22, 2017 19:30:41 GMT -5
UGA 1-1 with the cocks. It’s a miracle.
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Post by zizou on Oct 23, 2017 15:39:47 GMT -5
Did anyone see this match and would care to comment? I was driving home from a glorious youth soccer weekend and missed it.
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Post by zizou on Oct 27, 2017 11:56:59 GMT -5
I know everyone is jacked about ATL United, rightfully so. But a few miles east and another soccer story was coming to a close last evening. UGA women finished the worst 3 year run in program history. There is not a close second for this level of futility at UGA.:
UGA Last Three Years Overall record: 15-35-4 SEC Record: 6-24-1
I have heard all of the excuses. Bottom line is that there are no excuses for this level of performance. All you have to do is watch them play. They are not fit, they are not athletic, they are technically lacking compared to their competition, and they are not high soccer IQ players. The fit part is mostly on the players, but also on the coach. The other differentiators are on the coach in terms of recruiting and training. And things are not looking up. There are 17 top 150 players from Georgia in the next two recruiting classes. It appears that UGA is in on two to three of them. Recruiting rankings are not everything, but they are something. UGA recruiting class rankings were in the teens under the previous coaching regime; they are in the 50s or so now. This is not a promising trend. Maybe some verbals will change. Maybe all of the new and incoming players are diamonds in the rough. Eleven seniors played their last game last evening. When those players were freshmen they actually had a decent team. One major thing has changed.
You might think UGA athletics administration would be disturbed by the trend in this program. But they seem to think everything is on the right track. No kidding. I find this amazing. Even with suboptimal talent a good coaching staff will be able to help the players compete. Right now that is a problem. It is different being the guy responsible for running the drills versus being "The Guy."
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Post by flopper on Oct 27, 2017 16:06:50 GMT -5
Two things really stand out when looking at their stats.
1. At a top level, their ability to generate offense is bad. But take away their 9-1 win vs Coastal Carolina (RPI 201) and you have a team that scored 12 goals in 17 games. That's pretty atrocious at any level.
2. Small sample size, but it seems quite possible they played the wrong keeper for far too many minutes. I know oftentimes the best defense is a good offense (which was clearly not happening), but the starting goalie probably had too long of a leash.
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Post by zizou on Oct 27, 2017 19:30:22 GMT -5
Two things really stand out when looking at their stats. 1. At a top level, their ability to generate offense is bad. But take away their 9-1 win vs Coastal Carolina (RPI 201) and you have a team that scored 12 goals in 17 games. That's pretty atrocious at any level. 2. Small sample size, but it seems quite possible they played the wrong keeper for far too many minutes. I know oftentimes the best defense is a good offense (which was clearly not happening), but the starting goalie probably had too long of a leash. Just to highlight your point about their scoring problems. Kentucky, who they played last evening, lost their scholarship keepers to injury weeks ago. They have been rotating field player in goal. Georgia could not score against Kentucky.
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Post by Keeper on Oct 28, 2017 23:00:19 GMT -5
Two things really stand out when looking at their stats. 1. At a top level, their ability to generate offense is bad. But take away their 9-1 win vs Coastal Carolina (RPI 201) and you have a team that scored 12 goals in 17 games. That's pretty atrocious at any level. 2. Small sample size, but it seems quite possible they played the wrong keeper for far too many minutes. I know oftentimes the best defense is a good offense (which was clearly not happening), but the starting goalie probably had too long of a leash. Just to highlight your point about their scoring problems. Kentucky, who they played last evening, lost their scholarship keepers to injury weeks ago. They have been rotating field player in goal. Georgia could not score against Kentucky. Rotating field players?!? At D1 and SEC level?! Holy crap! Give that team and coach a trophy for perseverance!
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Post by Strikermom on Nov 1, 2017 15:01:31 GMT -5
Just read that the uGA Club team finished third in region and going to nationals in Phoenix. Are these girls former varsity team players, or girls that didn't get recruited and still love to play?
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Post by paterfamilias on Nov 1, 2017 15:22:45 GMT -5
Those are girls who choose not to play d1 in college and go to UGA. Many were recruited, just perhaps not by UGA. the time commitment and pressure is much less
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Post by Strikermom on Nov 1, 2017 15:26:38 GMT -5
Checked out their website, official tryouts, only 2 nights of practice, but they do travel to all the D1 schools. Great option for some talented girls.
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