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Post by oraclesfriend on Mar 5, 2020 18:00:07 GMT -5
Your point about UFA and 2nd teams for girls needs to be put in some context. First, Tophat did not think SCCL was good enough for 2nd teams either and like it or not there is competition between clubs for 2nd team players. Second, NPL is shrinking on the girls side because of DPL (lost USA Mt Pleasant last year) and ECRL (losing both Charlotte Indepence teams this year) and lost CSA last year which was also 2 teams. So that is 5 teams lost in 2 years. Who knows who they will add but last year they lost 3 and added 1. Chattanooga Red Wolves was the addition and they were not as good as CSA south and USA Mt Pleasant. I am sure they will be hard pressed to replace the two Charlotte Independence teams. The boys side is larger. Third, the boys side is not affected by ECRL and DPL which are designed for 2nd teams of ECNL and DA clubs because they don't exist (yet). Fourth, NPL had a reputation on the boys side that was stronger than the reputation on the girls side. There is even a finals tournament that has ECNL teams and NPL teams (gasp) compete against each other put on by US Club. NPL is different for boys and girls. I also believe that UFA really wants to use SCCL to stabilize and improve Norcross on the girls side, but also needs Fowler to be deep at the older ages. My 2 cents. Your point about DPL getting these girls minutes on DA is a valid one. I agree. Or at least training with DA with a chance to earn minutes. I can see where SCCL might not be good enough competition for Tophat's 2nd teams, but for UFA? They didn't exactly destroy everyone in the SCCL and NPL leagues they were already in... They were middle to bottom of the pack in both of them. If they are trying to get to a more competitive level, based on their past results, I dont see the need for it. ...as an aside, I have also seen where UFA will rather look to outside players to guest play on their DA teams rather than pull players up, so other than training with DA players occassionally, I dont think it would help them that much... which is unfortunate. This is not exactly true. The 04 Forsyth girls won NPL division and the 03 Norcross won back to back SCCL 12-0-2 this season with a +38 goal differential (including winning the National Cup last year). The 03 Forsyth came in second in NPL with 9-1-2 record just 2 points behind the leader who was 10-1-1. The 02/01 girls Forsyth did well also and were very close to the top as they were all stacked together only a few points separating the top 3. That team lost a few to DA this year and had won NPL the last two years plus played NL last year too. So the top three age groups were very strong. The younger age groups were they have DA (U14 and U15) did not do as well, but those teams are a mishmash of kids coming together from many teams and losing some kids who don't make DA to other clubs' ECNL and other teams. Once they have time to gel and there is less movement it seems to settle and the teams do well as they age. As for the DA teams pulling from outside the club...it does seem that has happened at a number of age groups this past year, but there have been promoted internal players as well particularly at the oldest age group and youngest age group. |
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Post by dadofthree on Mar 5, 2020 18:08:00 GMT -5
Agreed, ECRL will not have much clout at all, and it shouldn't (DPL either). Both SHOULD be a mid-tier leagues with less travel than the 1st team, for 2nd team players and the purpose should be the go-to developmental team for the 1st team. If a club is going to a younger team or outside the club to replace players during a season, they're failing to develop the 2nd team players. The focus should be development, not winning.
The ONLY advantage that ECRL (other than a patch maybe?) would have is that teams that WIN their ECRL league get to compete with ECNL teams (or so they say) in finals/maybe showcases? So in some ways it could be like a 2nd ECNL team for really big clubs with strong 2nd teams. For NTH, other than the fact the club bought into the DA/USNT Kool Aid, this league would have been very good situation for them, as their 2nd team can beat most everyone else's 2nd teams and they would have regularly been in the mix. Does DPL => DA have any similar tie-ins?
There is suppose to be at least something similar. I know NTH DPL teams were asked to play in the DA showcase in Florida in Dec but they couldnt get the commitments of the players to go since it was right before finals and its rumored that southeast winning ages will be playing at least at the same fields and times as the DA summer showcase in California so at least there is some exposure. |
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Post by soccerloafer on Mar 5, 2020 22:38:33 GMT -5
In my experience, on the girls side:
DA > ECNL
ECNL = DPL
DPL > RPL > SCCL RPL closer to DPL than SCCL
no experience with NPL
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Post by guerillaman on Mar 5, 2020 22:40:49 GMT -5
the only word you should need when talking about the game is
soccer
parents shouldn't need an acronym decoder from Ovaltine to make sense of youth soccer
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Post by soccerlegacy on Mar 6, 2020 10:14:28 GMT -5
I can see where SCCL might not be good enough competition for Tophat's 2nd teams, but for UFA? They didn't exactly destroy everyone in the SCCL and NPL leagues they were already in... They were middle to bottom of the pack in both of them. If they are trying to get to a more competitive level, based on their past results, I dont see the need for it. ...as an aside, I have also seen where UFA will rather look to outside players to guest play on their DA teams rather than pull players up, so other than training with DA players occassionally, I dont think it would help them that much... which is unfortunate. This is not exactly true. The 04 Forsyth girls won NPL division and the 03 Norcross won back to back SCCL 12-0-2 this season with a +38 goal differential (including winning the National Cup last year). The 03 Forsyth came in second in NPL with 9-1-2 record just 2 points behind the leader who was 10-1-1. The 02/01 girls Forsyth did well also and were very close to the top as they were all stacked together only a few points separating the top 3. That team lost a few to DA this year and had won NPL the last two years plus played NL last year too. So the top three age groups were very strong. The younger age groups were they have DA (U14 and U15) did not do as well, but those teams are a mishmash of kids coming together from many teams and losing some kids who don't make DA to other clubs' ECNL and other teams. Once they have time to gel and there is less movement it seems to settle and the teams do well as they age. As for the DA teams pulling from outside the club...it does seem that has happened at a number of age groups this past year, but there have been promoted internal players as well particularly at the oldest age group and youngest age group. Other than the 2 teams you mentioned ('04 NPL and '03 SCCL) I don't see them having a need for DPL, which they are telling people would be more competitive? ( although I don't know how much of that is really true either). As a whole for UFA here are the results: 2018 SCCL results:8th , 4th, 8th, 6th, 1st, 8th 2019 SCCL results:12th and 13th (2 teams at U12), 8th, 4th, 4th, 8th, 4th 2019 NPL results:3rd, 3rd, 6th, 5th, 1st, 2nd, 4th That does not scream to me that the SCCL and NPL are not good enough for their 2nd teams. As for pulling players from outside, I know for a fact that it has happened more often than just this past year and has happened as far back as 2017 at least ( when I became aware of this practice) and DID happen at the younger ages also. I just feel that selling parents that DPL is needed due to lack of competition in the current leagues and is pathway to the DA team is bordering on dishonesty... Again, Tophat was a different story... They lost ECNL and had to find a place for those teams. Not to mention they were obviously dominating the SCCL in it's inaugural year. Their results are: 2018 SCCL Results:1st, 1st, 1st, 1st, 2nd, 2nd |
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Post by oraclesfriend on Mar 6, 2020 11:55:52 GMT -5
This is not exactly true. The 04 Forsyth girls won NPL division and the 03 Norcross won back to back SCCL 12-0-2 this season with a +38 goal differential (including winning the National Cup last year). The 03 Forsyth came in second in NPL with 9-1-2 record just 2 points behind the leader who was 10-1-1. The 02/01 girls Forsyth did well also and were very close to the top as they were all stacked together only a few points separating the top 3. That team lost a few to DA this year and had won NPL the last two years plus played NL last year too. So the top three age groups were very strong. The younger age groups were they have DA (U14 and U15) did not do as well, but those teams are a mishmash of kids coming together from many teams and losing some kids who don't make DA to other clubs' ECNL and other teams. Once they have time to gel and there is less movement it seems to settle and the teams do well as they age. As for the DA teams pulling from outside the club...it does seem that has happened at a number of age groups this past year, but there have been promoted internal players as well particularly at the oldest age group and youngest age group. Other than the 2 teams you mentioned ('04 NPL and '03 SCCL) I don't see them having a need for DPL, which they are telling people would be more competitive? ( although I don't know how much of that is really true either). As a whole for UFA here are the results: 2018 SCCL results:8th , 4th, 8th, 6th, 1st, 8th 2019 SCCL results:12th and 13th (2 teams at U12), 8th, 4th, 4th, 8th, 4th 2019 NPL results:3rd, 3rd, 6th, 5th, 1st, 2nd, 4th That does not scream to me that the SCCL and NPL are not good enough for their 2nd teams. As for pulling players from outside, I know for a fact that it has happened more often than just this past year and has happened as far back as 2017 at least ( when I became aware of this practice) and DID happen at the younger ages also. I just feel that selling parents that DPL is needed due to lack of competition in the current leagues and is pathway to the DA team is bordering on dishonesty... Again, Tophat was a different story... They lost ECNL and had to find a place for those teams. Not to mention they were obviously dominating the SCCL in it's inaugural year. Their results are: 2018 SCCL Results:1st, 1st, 1st, 1st, 2nd, 2nd I am not arguing that they pull from outside the club. They do. As does everyone else. Everyone. I wish that wasn't the case, but it is. My argument is that there are some age groups that dominate or do very well in NPL and SCCL. Please don't count the U12 in SCCL. One team is a U11 team. It is unfair to put them in that position. They do VERY well in their own age group. I will say that no one at UFA had tried to sell DPL to the parents as necessary for the level of competition...yet. There has been no official announcement that they are even in it nor what they plan to do with it vs NPL vs SCCL. What I do think will be clear is that the level of competition in NPL is going down with clubs leaving it. There also may not be many games due to lack of teams. What I do think DPL does better is that they have showcases. NPL doesn't. I think they will have an edge in recruiting. That could be a selling point. All I was trying to point out was the blanket statement that UFA was struggling in NPL and SCCL and that is not true. There are some age groups that are not doing well in one or the other (or both). |
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Post by mistergrinch on Mar 6, 2020 12:00:48 GMT -5
If a club is going to a younger team or outside the club to replace players during a season, they're failing to develop the 2nd team players. The focus should be development, not winning.
Pretty sure I've NEVER seen a top team pull from a 2nd team (and almost as rarely seen a 2nd team pull from a 3rd team). It's always from a lower age group, or go find a club hopper to join. To me, that reflects terribly on how the club actually develops players.
One thing I've seen very little of is coaches actually working with the teams below them. "hey, this is what I want to see".. maybe the talk away from practices, but I rarely see them actually working together or watching each others teams play.
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Post by atlfutboldad on Mar 6, 2020 12:04:46 GMT -5
To be fair im not talking about tryouts, then it's fair game. But yeah, at our age group, in games our 1st/2nd teams pull from the teams below them at the same age group.
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Post by ultimatedad on Mar 6, 2020 12:06:14 GMT -5
If UFA goes into DPL their third level team will be in SCCL. This will be a bad look from UFA for teams considering the SCCL brand. Wasn't this league created by UFA? Quite the conundrum for UFA management.
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Post by honeybadger on Mar 6, 2020 12:31:27 GMT -5
Interesting point about UFA. Being a UFA SCCL parent, that makes me go hhhhmmmmmm.......  |
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Post by atlfutboldad on Mar 6, 2020 12:34:51 GMT -5
SCCL already IS their 3rd team (co-2nd team if you really want to think of it that way). The Forsyth Premier team is currently in NPL, they would simply move to the DPL league. More travel, but if you're into that, its a similar deal.
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Post by soccerlegacy on Mar 6, 2020 13:38:29 GMT -5
Other than the 2 teams you mentioned ('04 NPL and '03 SCCL) I don't see them having a need for DPL, which they are telling people would be more competitive? ( although I don't know how much of that is really true either). As a whole for UFA here are the results: 2018 SCCL results:8th , 4th, 8th, 6th, 1st, 8th 2019 SCCL results:12th and 13th (2 teams at U12), 8th, 4th, 4th, 8th, 4th 2019 NPL results:3rd, 3rd, 6th, 5th, 1st, 2nd, 4th That does not scream to me that the SCCL and NPL are not good enough for their 2nd teams. As for pulling players from outside, I know for a fact that it has happened more often than just this past year and has happened as far back as 2017 at least ( when I became aware of this practice) and DID happen at the younger ages also. I just feel that selling parents that DPL is needed due to lack of competition in the current leagues and is pathway to the DA team is bordering on dishonesty... Again, Tophat was a different story... They lost ECNL and had to find a place for those teams. Not to mention they were obviously dominating the SCCL in it's inaugural year. Their results are: 2018 SCCL Results:1st, 1st, 1st, 1st, 2nd, 2nd I am not arguing that they pull from outside the club. They do. As does everyone else. Everyone. I wish that wasn't the case, but it is. My argument is that there are some age groups that dominate or do very well in NPL and SCCL. Please don't count the U12 in SCCL. One team is a U11 team. It is unfair to put them in that position. They do VERY well in their own age group. I will say that no one at UFA had tried to sell DPL to the parents as necessary for the level of competition...yet. There has been no official announcement that they are even in it nor what they plan to do with it vs NPL vs SCCL. What I do think will be clear is that the level of competition in NPL is going down with clubs leaving it. There also may not be many games due to lack of teams. What I do think DPL does better is that they have showcases. NPL doesn't. I think they will have an edge in recruiting. That could be a selling point. All I was trying to point out was the blanket statement that UFA was struggling in NPL and SCCL and that is not true. There are some age groups that are not doing well in one or the other (or both). Fair enough. I didn't mean to make a blanket statement about ALL of UFA being middle to bottom of NPL and SCCL, just that most of them are. The numbers speak for themselves. And I only included the U12 because it IS in the leagues and I didn't want for it to seem like I was cherry-picking. Plus, those U12 teams will become their future (minus the yearly lose a few, gain a few tryouts). You stated " Your point about UFA and 2nd teams for girls needs to be put in some context. First, Tophat did not think SCCL was good enough for 2nd teams either..." I was simply looking at the context you spoke of and showing that I don't think UFA can stand on that as a reason, like Tophat can, when the rankings don't justify it. Also, just to be clear, I wasn't attacking you, I was just laying out the case for why? UFA is rumored to be going to DPL. Personally, I think it is just like you also stated... the NPL is crumbling, however, it's not because of the level of competition, but rather the lack of competition due to the withdrawals. It just seems like DPL (the southeast version) all of a sudden gets this "cred" as a better league, when in actuality, it is just taking a team from one league and placing it in another...much like RPL teams that moved to SCCL. I think DPL gets a benefit when a club with the reputation of Tophat joins it also... so that helps. I don't know about their showcases, but wouldn't the big ones suffice (Disney, Jeff Cup, etc). |
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Post by atlfutboldad on Mar 6, 2020 13:44:15 GMT -5
DPL will be a quality league, with many clubs' first and 2nd teams...at a parallel level to NPL now. Travel is really the only detractor. But hey, if kids and parents want to do it, good luck to them! And if they can get to play in some of the same showcases as DA teams, all the better.
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Post by justwatching on Mar 6, 2020 13:51:45 GMT -5
Seems like it is probably a good move for UFA to go DPL. If NPL is loosing teams, which all indication is more are leaving after this season, NPL will not be a viable league to stay in. They already have a team in SCCL (their 3rd team) so now they would be in a similar situation as Tophat last year. UFA doesn't have the depth of Tophat with their girls' but they still have the dilemma of where to put the 2nd team. GA Soccer seems to be done if with SCCL expansion and the expected teams to move to it so there really is nowhere else for them to go. SCCL for their second team would be a bad move as SCCL isn't at a high enough level right now from both play or brand to attract or keep quality kids there. Their current teams might fit in ok in SCCL but from a strategic long term view it would be bad for UFA creating depth and growth in their girls' program. DPL might not have the brand yet either but with it growing and if in fact it becomes DA clubs' second team league it will gain credibility based on the clubs' involved in it reputation.
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Post by ultimatedad on Mar 6, 2020 14:05:34 GMT -5
If they asked nicely they might get their second team into Athena A but they are probably too prideful.
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Post by justwatching on Mar 6, 2020 14:14:43 GMT -5
If they asked nicely they might get their second team into Athena A but they are probably too prideful. I'm assuming that comment is meant to be sarcastic. |
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Post by honeybadger on Mar 6, 2020 14:15:00 GMT -5
The UFA Norcross 05 SCCL team played the UFA NPL team in a tournament and lost 2-1. Very even match. Both teams had chances for 2-3 more goals each. As a Norcross parent I'd like to see UFA pick the fields off McGinnis Ferry (don't recall the name at the moment) for the potential DPL team so that both teams can have players tryout for the team:) I think if the NPL team and the SCCL team took the best 8 or so from each team, that would be a very solid DPL team. Or for giggles, let them play a best of 5 playoff and winner gets DPL...........(just being humorous.). But in all seriousness, a location central to Fowler and Norcross would allow some players a better opportunity. |
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Post by soccerlegacy on Mar 6, 2020 14:29:38 GMT -5
Seems like it is probably a good move for UFA to go DPL. If NPL is loosing teams, which all indication is more are leaving after this season, NPL will not be a viable league to stay in. They already have a team in SCCL (their 3rd team) so now they would be in a similar situation as Tophat last year. UFA doesn't have the depth of Tophat with their girls' but they still have the dilemma of where to put the 2nd team. GA Soccer seems to be done if with SCCL expansion and the expected teams to move to it so there really is nowhere else for them to go. SCCL for their second team would be a bad move as SCCL isn't at a high enough level right now from both play or brand to attract or keep quality kids there. Their current teams might fit in ok in SCCL but from a strategic long term view it would be bad for UFA creating depth and growth in their girls' program. DPL might not have the brand yet either but with it growing and if in fact it becomes DA clubs' second team league it will gain credibility based on the clubs' involved in it reputation. Well... their SCCL team is sort of a co-2nd team already, just based out of Norcross (their top team). I don't have the stats for it, but from what I've heard, when the NPL (Forsyth) and SCCL (Norcross) of UFA have met up, it's been fairly even. Please correct me if I have that wrong. I would like to see them truly get a second team combined from both locations and play in the SCCL. But, like most have said about DPL... it's more travel and cost, but if you're into that... |
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Post by ultimatedad on Mar 6, 2020 14:35:15 GMT -5
It seems as if UFA has two second teams. And two third teams. It seems like the club needs a play off.
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Post by atlfutboldad on Mar 6, 2020 14:39:32 GMT -5
Athena A with the 6 other clubs left in GA Soccer after the SCCL/Inter/Impact splits this year? SCCL not at a high enough level? There's teams in every age group of SCCL that can beat the equivalent Forsyth Premier teams. Its at a similar level for most clubs, there's actually a remarkable amount of parity between clubs in SCCL (except BUSA and largely CESA). DPL from a strategic point of view...that perspective would work if youth soccer participation was increasing, but its actually declining. If all the rumors are to be believed...of the 42 2006 teams in Athena this fall, HALF will be gone to SCCL leagues and the new Inter league.
But I also feel like why are we so dead set on having the 2nd teams be travel teams? DPL and ECRL are all about keeping up with the Jones's at this point. Moreso than development. So its all about recruiting.
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Post by soccerlegacy on Mar 6, 2020 14:46:18 GMT -5
Athena A with the 6 other clubs left in GA Soccer after the SCCL/Inter/Impact splits this year? SCCL not at a high enough level? There's teams in every age group of SCCL that can beat the equivalent Forsyth Premier teams. Its at a similar level for most clubs, there's actually a remarkable amount of parity between clubs in SCCL (except BUSA and largely CESA). DPL from a strategic point of view...that perspective would work if youth soccer participation was increasing, but its actually declining. If all the rumors are to be believed...of the 42 2006 teams in Athena this fall, HALF will be gone to SCCL leagues and the new Inter league.
But I also feel like why are we so dead set on having the 2nd teams be travel teams? DPL and ECRL are all about keeping up with the Jones's at this point. Moreso than development. So its all about recruiting.
Bingo. Agreed. |
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Post by mistergrinch on Mar 6, 2020 14:54:33 GMT -5
The UFA Norcross 05 SCCL team played the UFA NPL team in a tournament and lost 2-1. Very even match. Both teams had chances for 2-3 more goals each. As a Norcross parent I'd like to see UFA pick the fields off McGinnis Ferry (don't recall the name at the moment) for the potential DPL team so that both teams can have players tryout for the team:) I think if the NPL team and the SCCL team took the best 8 or so from each team, that would be a very solid DPL team. Or for giggles, let them play a best of 5 playoff and winner gets DPL...........(just being humorous.). But in all seriousness, a location central to Fowler and Norcross would allow some players a better opportunity. This would be a great way to lose a ton of people. Getting to those fields in the evening from the Forsyth side of the world is just awful (also, they're crappy fields). |
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Post by honeybadger on Mar 6, 2020 15:03:33 GMT -5
The UFA Norcross 05 SCCL team played the UFA NPL team in a tournament and lost 2-1. Very even match. Both teams had chances for 2-3 more goals each. As a Norcross parent I'd like to see UFA pick the fields off McGinnis Ferry (don't recall the name at the moment) for the potential DPL team so that both teams can have players tryout for the team:) I think if the NPL team and the SCCL team took the best 8 or so from each team, that would be a very solid DPL team. Or for giggles, let them play a best of 5 playoff and winner gets DPL...........(just being humorous.). But in all seriousness, a location central to Fowler and Norcross would allow some players a better opportunity. This would be a great way to lose a ton of people. Getting to those fields in the evening from the Forsyth side of the world is just awful (also, they're crappy fields). I wish UFA had another field equal distance between the two locations that didn't stink.  -----agree, those fields are lacking , to be kind |
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Post by soccerlegacy on Mar 6, 2020 15:25:48 GMT -5
The UFA Norcross 05 SCCL team played the UFA NPL team in a tournament and lost 2-1. Very even match. Both teams had chances for 2-3 more goals each. As a Norcross parent I'd like to see UFA pick the fields off McGinnis Ferry (don't recall the name at the moment) for the potential DPL team so that both teams can have players tryout for the team:) I think if the NPL team and the SCCL team took the best 8 or so from each team, that would be a very solid DPL team. Or for giggles, let them play a best of 5 playoff and winner gets DPL...........(just being humorous.). But in all seriousness, a location central to Fowler and Norcross would allow some players a better opportunity. I personally think there is enough talent in the Atl metro area and a few clubs from close states that there shouldn't be a need for 2nd teams (at ANY of the Atlanta clubs) that would NEED to travel like DPL does. That being said, if UFA were to combine the NPL and SCCL players to make a DPL team, that might be the only legitimate way I could see the usefulness of entering the DPL. |
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Post by atlfutboldad on Mar 6, 2020 15:32:50 GMT -5
The UFA Norcross 05 SCCL team played the UFA NPL team in a tournament and lost 2-1. Very even match. Both teams had chances for 2-3 more goals each. As a Norcross parent I'd like to see UFA pick the fields off McGinnis Ferry (don't recall the name at the moment) for the potential DPL team so that both teams can have players tryout for the team:) I think if the NPL team and the SCCL team took the best 8 or so from each team, that would be a very solid DPL team. Or for giggles, let them play a best of 5 playoff and winner gets DPL...........(just being humorous.). But in all seriousness, a location central to Fowler and Norcross would allow some players a better opportunity. This would be a great way to lose a ton of people. Getting to those fields in the evening from the Forsyth side of the world is just awful (also, they're crappy fields).
AFU would likely be happy to take them off UFA's hands...  We drove through there every Wednesday in the fall (on the way to practices at Pinecrest), traffic didn't seem that bad. |
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Post by oraclesfriend on Mar 6, 2020 17:18:00 GMT -5
If they asked nicely they might get their second team into Athena A but they are probably too prideful. The second team steamrolled the Athena A teams in any games that I saw. That was even last year before many of the better Athena A went to SCCL-P. Georgia soccer is done. |
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Post by ultimatedad on Mar 6, 2020 20:13:43 GMT -5
I just checked out the u13 Athena for giggles and it looks pretty competitive. Or at least a lot more competitive than I thought it would be. Actually looks like a fairly attractive league.
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Post by justwatching on Mar 9, 2020 11:42:41 GMT -5
Athena A with the 6 other clubs left in GA Soccer after the SCCL/Inter/Impact splits this year? SCCL not at a high enough level? There's teams in every age group of SCCL that can beat the equivalent Forsyth Premier teams. Its at a similar level for most clubs, there's actually a remarkable amount of parity between clubs in SCCL (except BUSA and largely CESA). DPL from a strategic point of view...that perspective would work if youth soccer participation was increasing, but its actually declining. If all the rumors are to be believed...of the 42 2006 teams in Athena this fall, HALF will be gone to SCCL leagues and the new Inter league.
But I also feel like why are we so dead set on having the 2nd teams be travel teams? DPL and ECRL are all about keeping up with the Jones's at this point. Moreso than development. So its all about recruiting.
Bingo. Agreed. I am assuming this is responding to my post. I personally don't think the typical second team needs to be a travel team. But there are exceptions here. Strong DA clubs like Tophat need a league other than SCCL for second team players. When I am talking about this topic I am really considering clubs where the player pool would be ECNL if the club's were able to retain DA and ECNL. So these are high caliber players (likely D1 prospects for recruiting purposes) but not at the DA level. To put a team of those kids in SCCL would be a disservice to them and the kids who have to play them. I understand UFA is not at the same level as far as depth as Tophat but if the club has aspirations to get there you have to have a product which can retain and attract kids at that level. This is why I say strategically it could be a good long term move for them. Offer DA --> SCCL you are likely surrendering those in between kids to another club. I don't even necessarily think that is a terrible thing for the kids to have to move somewhere else because it would indirectly strengthen all the other leagues/teams but it is not a good situation for the club in terms of player retention, building depth, and a brand for your program. Also from a player perspective all clubs are not created equal so for those kids who want to stay with their club because the style of play or philosophy (e.g. possession vs playing direct) is what they like better might not want to have to leave that club to still play "high level" soccer. I think TH is a really good case. Had DA and ECNL lost ECNL/chose DA and the SCCL teams in the first year dominated in all age groups. After that they ended up losing some of those kids to other clubs hence losing some depth and probably ultimately affecting the brand they created... but this is just my speculation/opinion. |
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Post by putmeincoach on Mar 9, 2020 12:28:03 GMT -5
I am assuming this is responding to my post. I personally don't think the typical second team needs to be a travel team. But there are exceptions here. Strong DA clubs like Tophat need a league other than SCCL for second team players. When I am talking about this topic I am really considering clubs where the player pool would be ECNL if the club's were able to retain DA and ECNL. So these are high caliber players (likely D1 prospects for recruiting purposes) but not at the DA level. To put a team of those kids in SCCL would be a disservice to them and the kids who have to play them. I understand UFA is not at the same level as far as depth as Tophat but if the club has aspirations to get there you have to have a product which can retain and attract kids at that level. This is why I say strategically it could be a good long term move for them. Offer DA --> SCCL you are likely surrendering those in between kids to another club. I don't even necessarily think that is a terrible thing for the kids to have to move somewhere else because it would indirectly strengthen all the other leagues/teams but it is not a good situation for the club in terms of player retention, building depth, and a brand for your program. Also from a player perspective all clubs are not created equal so for those kids who want to stay with their club because the style of play or philosophy (e.g. possession vs playing direct) is what they like better might not want to have to leave that club to still play "high level" soccer. I think TH is a really good case. Had DA and ECNL lost ECNL/chose DA and the SCCL teams in the first year dominated in all age groups. After that they ended up losing some of those kids to other clubs hence losing some depth and probably ultimately affecting the brand they created... but this is just my speculation/opinion. I agree that many of these 2nd teams have players greater than SCCL level and there needs to be a league where these players are challenged. I would like to see these teams come back to USYS leagues and let the better teams qualify. Case in point the winner of the Texas and California DPL goes on to earn a slot in the National League (real one) and from as far as I can tell not one of those teams is going to win their group, with most mid table or lower. Creating another league with random South and Central FL teams isn't the answer and if any of these directors were looking out for the players best interest they'd take the "best of the rest" (whoever those teams prove to be) and let them play in USYS style league that you actually have to qualify for. I see absolutely ZERO value to flying these teams to Cali to play, total money grab to play in front of almost no colleges. |
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Post by atlfutboldad on Mar 9, 2020 12:50:27 GMT -5
There is nothing preventing GA Soccer from promoting the winner of SCCL to National League (should they want to accept). SC Youth Soccer does it now. And Tophat showed us that no one's 2nd team on the girls side is good enough for an elite league. Would it be such a bad thing for 3rd level players to seek greener pastures? They're basically setting up that possibility with DPL. But for the 2nd team parents who want that travel team status and can/will afford it, good luck. I hope you at least make up that $20K (for 4 years league/travel) in scholarships or that the money it is just throw-away money to you.
edit: We will see how people view this league come tryouts. So under three months. It would be an interesting experiment if UFA offered SCCL first team in Forsyth and whether the current NPL families try out for DPL or SCCL.
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-----agree, those fields are lacking , to be kind
