shaka
Jr. Academy
Posts: 96
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TH "Camp"
May 31, 2019 23:31:01 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by shaka on May 31, 2019 23:31:01 GMT -5
TC doesn't need to "recruit". The new families and players are attending willingly. Look at posts about other clubs. UFA specifically. Many of these clubs self-destruct on their own & TH is waiting there with open arms. They don't have to "recruit" I don't know that the other clubs "self-destruct." Not giving in to demands that are unreasonable for the club to arrange within their current structure is not self-destructing. There can be a vocal minority that asks for things that the majority actually don't want.. those vocal few can leave and go elsewhere and that isn't self-destruction. I have a lot of respect for Tophat and what they are able to with the players they have and continue to acquire, however as soccerfan30 stated the parents there can make demands and Tophat will cave in at times. I am aware of a player last year who tried out for ECNL and did not make it (made SCCL). Her parents complained so much and Tophat caved and put her on the ECNL team. That is not right. The player should have been left on the SCCL team. Agreed. My post said "many" clubs self destruct. Not all do of course. Certain parents can make it difficult for clubs but clubs can also sometimes be at fault. Not trying to rehash the UFA conversation but part of the issue there with the departures was related to the coach, who is representative of the club. The demands of the parents was a separate issue. |
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Post by hattrick07 on Jun 5, 2019 9:57:47 GMT -5
We were warned by numerous parents and coaches alike not to go to TH. I wish I had listened.
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Post by soccermaxx72 on Jun 5, 2019 10:35:22 GMT -5
What exactly is this camp intended for other than to collect $155? My daughter attended last night. Upon check-in, the girls were separated into what level they played last year and than basically scrimmaged for an hour an a half. There were 2 coaches (EH and PD) in attendance who walked around, No instruction, No drills and honestly did not pay attention to the girls. My daughter has been working hard this offseason, improving her technical ability with the goal of trying out for a higher caliber team, only to be lumped in with younger girls who were needed to be able to field teams. I know the bulk of this board is focused on DA / NPL / ECNL however how does one progress if they are automatically cast aside without a look? She's not at that level but is more than capable of SCCL (sure I'm a bit biased but also a realist). We simply didn't have the funds last year so she didn't push for it and I regret that. However, she did play (and start every game) Varsity for her HS team which made it to the Elite 8 in State. This may be premature and hopefully she'll get an actual look during actual tryouts next week but she was frustrated because this is exactly how TH tryouts were handled last year. The SCCL team was 95% filled before tryouts and the remaining players were cobbled together to form another team with a random coach who was more interested in his college team than developing the girls. It seemed like a money grab at the time and feels eerily similar with this "camp". Long time lurker - finally decided to post as we are in eerily similar situation with TH. Our daughter went to the camp and had very similar comments... Disorganized, little or no direction and they just scrimmaged. Shift to tryouts this week and day 1 -similar results. Late start due to boys not getting off the field. Little communication other than - automatically pre-judging girls by "where did you play last year... go there" . She got plenty of playing time - made some really nice runs and even made a few of her HS teamates on the SCCL look silly with moves but noticed that coaches were not really paying attention and never spoke to her. Turns out, they had a separate practice on Sun or monday prior to tryouts and invited a few girls and made offers... very disappointing. Will she land on a team, sure. If it's an A level team, that's ok as long as she's happy and doing what she loves. What is frustrating is that these teams tend to be as you say "cobbled" together with the cast offs, some not even A level material. Another new coach with no history this year who hopefully does not go through the motions and does not pushing these teams. They should be scrimmaging the SCCL or practicing together to help truly develop and progress the girls. Play in higher level tournaments even if it means losing. See how they compete. My daughter just wants to enjoy the last few years of playing before she heads off to college (not play in college) but that doesn't mean she can't. Academics are the priority but she's also a fierce competitor so wherever she lands, hopefully it will be a team where she has friends and enjoys the game and the coach. There does not seem to be any real investment by TH to develop and progress the teams that are not DA/DPL/SCCL to get to the next level and that to me, feels like a money grab as well. And yet it sounds like you are willing to stay at TH, so mission accomplished for TH. Why is you daughter not trying out at a local SCCL or NPL or NL team within a short drive? |
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Post by Keeper on Jun 5, 2019 13:02:45 GMT -5
And yet it sounds like you are willing to stay at TH, so mission accomplished for TH. Why is you daughter not trying out at a local SCCL or NPL or NL team within a short drive? Well - Similar to what justadad said earlier on this thread - She's played for the team for awhile and while I'd lover for her to tryout elsewhere, just to see what's out there. I realize, it's not about me. If she was 12, things would be different but at 16/17 (U18), she's likes her friends, likes her team and realizes that she's not going to play D1 - wants to enjoy the remaining few years playing a game she loves. So I guess you are right: mission accomplished by TH. That doesn't mean I can't vent about it. Just wish I knew then what I know now. Just curious, are you Tophat? Or are you NASA? Sounds like you were there pre merger. |
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Post by broadwayboogiewoogie on Jun 5, 2019 13:12:37 GMT -5
We were warned by numerous parents and coaches alike not to go to TH. I wish I had listened. Not too late to get out! |
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Post by hattrick07 on Jun 5, 2019 13:18:27 GMT -5
@ broadwayboogiewoogie - Already left for ECNL at another club. I make mistakes, but also learn from them  Hard pass on the TH culture. |
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Post by hattrick07 on Jun 6, 2019 13:29:51 GMT -5
Those were the ones TC recruited... And new players are often given benefit over old players - the newness factor helps them a bit. My two cents. I assure you TC isn’t out there recruiting 10 year old kids. That’s silly on your part to believe that. it’s the parents reaching out and trying to get a chance at one of the 2 to 4 Gold Teams. 😝 |
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Post by hattrick07 on Jun 6, 2019 13:31:32 GMT -5
TH actually recruited a 10-year old goalie from SSA for the pre-DA team. That is indeed a fact.
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Post by hateallthesechanges on Jun 6, 2019 14:16:04 GMT -5
TH actually recruited a 10-year old goalie from SSA for the pre-DA team. That is indeed a fact. Supposedly TH "got a hold of" an 08 SSA roster. TH proceeded to call at least 10 players and offer them spots sight unseen. After tryouts were over. |
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Post by soccerlegacy on Jun 6, 2019 14:27:16 GMT -5
TH actually recruited a 10-year old goalie from SSA for the pre-DA team. That is indeed a fact. Supposedly TH "got a hold of" an 08 SSA roster. TH proceeded to call at least 10 players and offer them spots sight unseen. After tryouts were over. What?!? I find that hard to believe. It's not like SSA, or any club for that matter, has a collection of talent THAT good... let alone at 10 yrs old. Something doesn't jibe with this "supposed" rumor. |
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Post by hateallthesechanges on Jun 6, 2019 14:42:04 GMT -5
Supposedly TH "got a hold of" an 08 SSA roster. TH proceeded to call at least 10 players and offer them spots sight unseen. After tryouts were over. What?!? I find that hard to believe. It's not like SSA, or any club for that matter, has a collection of talent THAT good... let alone at 10 yrs old. Something doesn't jibe with this "supposed" rumor. TH 08 has never beaten SSA. There was another thread on here about TH 08 being the dream team next year because they acquired the best from SSA, Norcross, GSA... Note that poster never said they were going to be great because of any of their existing TH players. I do believe TH doesn't "steal" players in the dead of the night. Most go willingly because it clearly does have great training and access to national scouts, D1 college scouts... But I do believe some serious recruiting/hard selling does occur. |
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TH "Camp"
Jun 6, 2019 15:20:46 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by hattrick07 on Jun 6, 2019 15:20:46 GMT -5
What?!? I find that hard to believe. It's not like SSA, or any club for that matter, has a collection of talent THAT good... let alone at 10 yrs old. Something doesn't jibe with this "supposed" rumor. TH 08 has never beaten SSA. There was another thread on here about TH 08 being the dream team next year because they acquired the best from SSA, Norcross, GSA... Note that poster never said they were going to be great because of any of their existing TH players. I do believe TH doesn't "steal" players in the dead of the night. Most go willingly because it clearly does have great training and access to national scouts, D1 college scouts... But I do believe some serious recruiting/hard selling does occur. |
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TH "Camp"
Jun 6, 2019 15:21:16 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by hattrick07 on Jun 6, 2019 15:21:16 GMT -5
What?!? I find that hard to believe. It's not like SSA, or any club for that matter, has a collection of talent THAT good... let alone at 10 yrs old. Something doesn't jibe with this "supposed" rumor. TH 08 has never beaten SSA. There was another thread on here about TH 08 being the dream team next year because they acquired the best from SSA, Norcross, GSA... Note that poster never said they were going to be great because of any of their existing TH players. I do believe TH doesn't "steal" players in the dead of the night. Most go willingly because it clearly does have great training and access to national scouts, D1 college scouts... But I do believe some serious recruiting/hard selling does occur. |
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Post by 04gparent on Jun 6, 2019 15:34:05 GMT -5
TH 08 has never beaten SSA. There was another thread on here about TH 08 being the dream team next year because they acquired the best from SSA, Norcross, GSA... Note that poster never said they were going to be great because of any of their existing TH players. I do believe TH doesn't "steal" players in the dead of the night. Most go willingly because it clearly does have great training and access to national scouts, D1 college scouts... But I do believe some serious recruiting/hard selling does occur. I love the forum. I love the forum. Sometimes rumors become facts. I have been around girls soccer for the last 7 years. Based on the research TH doesnt always beat SSA at the younger age groups. Then we 11v11 happens all of a sudden the tables are turned. Why would any club "recruit" an academy aged player for a u11 or u12 season? 2008s are what u12 now? lol... I love the forum... |
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Post by fridge on Jun 6, 2019 15:58:58 GMT -5
04GParent--I think why people are jumping on this topic is because it is another example which runs contrary to THs constant and unmatched PR campaign that it is the "Development Club." I do think TH is a good club and does do a good job of training kids. HOWEVER, I think it does a much better job of recruiting. Beginning in ODP, 3v3 and other places. Heck, look its 03 and 02 girls in national pool right now and most came from other clubs (and were in the pool prior to coming to TH) in the past 12 -24 months. They do have some home grown kids but majority came from elsewhere.
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shaka
Jr. Academy
Posts: 96
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TH "Camp"
Jun 6, 2019 16:34:13 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by shaka on Jun 6, 2019 16:34:13 GMT -5
04GParent--I think why people are jumping on this topic is because it is another example which runs contrary to THs constant and unmatched PR campaign that it is the "Development Club." I do think TH is a good club and does do a good job of training kids. HOWEVER, I think it does a much better job of recruiting. Beginning in ODP, 3v3 and other places. Heck, look its 03 and 02 girls in national pool right now and most came from other clubs (and were in the pool prior to coming to TH) in the past 12 -24 months. They do have some home grown kids but majority came from elsewhere. Good points. They probably do a better job of "recruiting" because most people would say they have a better product than what other clubs have to offer. That's an observation not opinion, just saying  . It's still the Players, families choice to leave their clubs to go to TH. The term "recruiting" is very overused on this forum. I know several 02 & 03 national pool families. The ones that I know were not "recruited". They initiated communication with TH & subsequently left their club to join TH. And CF. I certainly don't doubt that many players have been "recruited" & not just by TH. Once the season is over, almost all clubs are "recruiting" - especially to keep the potential departing players from leaving the current Club. Perhaps this is "re-recruiting" :-) |
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Post by ihave3girlz on Jun 6, 2019 18:02:23 GMT -5
Supposedly TH "got a hold of" an 08 SSA roster. TH proceeded to call at least 10 players and offer them spots sight unseen. After tryouts were over. What?!? I find that hard to believe. It's not like SSA, or any club for that matter, has a collection of talent THAT good... let alone at 10 yrs old. Something doesn't jibe with this "supposed" rumor. It happened...fact. Was told by an 08 SSA parent who got the call themselves. I’m not saying this is only ever done by TH but in this case it was. Recruiting happens at all clubs...but taking a roster and trying to recruit 08 girls after tryouts is pretty low. |
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shaka
Jr. Academy
Posts: 96
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TH "Camp"
Jun 6, 2019 18:19:52 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by shaka on Jun 6, 2019 18:19:52 GMT -5
What?!? I find that hard to believe. It's not like SSA, or any club for that matter, has a collection of talent THAT good... let alone at 10 yrs old. Something doesn't jibe with this "supposed" rumor. It happened...fact. Was told by an 08 SSA parent who got the call themselves. I’m not saying this is only ever done by TH but in this case it was. Recruiting happens at all clubs...but taking a roster and trying to recruit 08 girls after tryouts is pretty low. Interesting if that did happen. My daughters were at TH pretryouts/tryouts - noticed several 08 SSA players on multiple nights. The parent that you reference, did the daughter attend TH tryout or did they just get a call out of the blue??? |
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TH "Camp"
Jun 6, 2019 18:47:20 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by ihave3girlz on Jun 6, 2019 18:47:20 GMT -5
It happened...fact. Was told by an 08 SSA parent who got the call themselves. I’m not saying this is only ever done by TH but in this case it was. Recruiting happens at all clubs...but taking a roster and trying to recruit 08 girls after tryouts is pretty low. Interesting if that did happen. My daughters were at TH pretryouts/tryouts - noticed several 08 SSA players on multiple nights. The parent that you reference, did the daughter attend TH tryout or did they just get a call out of the blue??? Out of the blue after tryouts were over. |
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TH "Camp"
Jun 6, 2019 19:00:54 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by vreview on Jun 6, 2019 19:00:54 GMT -5
Interesting if that did happen. My daughters were at TH pretryouts/tryouts - noticed several 08 SSA players on multiple nights. The parent that you reference, did the daughter attend TH tryout or did they just get a call out of the blue??? Out of the blue after tryouts were over. I have zero idea whether or not it occurred but at some level (if it is true) it doesnt really serve TH’s interest to have ALL the best players. Too many great players with too few teams to compete with them makes for very very boring soccer IMO. |
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Post by soccerfan30 on Jun 6, 2019 19:04:04 GMT -5
Most likely a parent that did it of their own volition, did not come from a TH Coach
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shaka
Jr. Academy
Posts: 96
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TH "Camp"
Jun 6, 2019 20:02:53 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by shaka on Jun 6, 2019 20:02:53 GMT -5
Most likely a parent that did it of their own volition, did not come from a TH Coach Agreed. |
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Post by 04gparent on Jun 6, 2019 20:07:25 GMT -5
04GParent--I think why people are jumping on this topic is because it is another example which runs contrary to THs constant and unmatched PR campaign that it is the "Development Club." I do think TH is a good club and does do a good job of training kids. HOWEVER, I think it does a much better job of recruiting. Beginning in ODP, 3v3 and other places. Heck, look its 03 and 02 girls in national pool right now and most came from other clubs (and were in the pool prior to coming to TH) in the past 12 -24 months. They do have some home grown kids but majority came from elsewhere. TH (and Concorde) are destination clubs. I cant blame any club for using social media to spread the news of their accomplishments. Heck last year with SSA won NPL in two age groups it was all over social media. What would you like for TH social media to do? Sample post: Congrats to player name1 (from CF, SSA) , and player name2 (born in South Alabama)... LOL. Reality is parents of players are the most influential in player accomplishments, not the club. Home grown is so subjective... |
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shaka
Jr. Academy
Posts: 96
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TH "Camp"
Jun 6, 2019 20:08:12 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by shaka on Jun 6, 2019 20:08:12 GMT -5
Interesting if that did happen. My daughters were at TH pretryouts/tryouts - noticed several 08 SSA players on multiple nights. The parent that you reference, did the daughter attend TH tryout or did they just get a call out of the blue??? Out of the blue after tryouts were over. Not doubting you were told this but definitely do not believe it happened. Totally out of character for TC. And the "best" SSA 08 players were already at TH tryouts. There were already a lot of the top 08s from other clubs at tryouts. No need to call players who didn't attend. |
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Post by fridge on Jun 7, 2019 8:20:54 GMT -5
04GParent--I think why people are jumping on this topic is because it is another example which runs contrary to THs constant and unmatched PR campaign that it is the "Development Club." I do think TH is a good club and does do a good job of training kids. HOWEVER, I think it does a much better job of recruiting. Beginning in ODP, 3v3 and other places. Heck, look its 03 and 02 girls in national pool right now and most came from other clubs (and were in the pool prior to coming to TH) in the past 12 -24 months. They do have some home grown kids but majority came from elsewhere. TH (and Concorde) are destination clubs. I cant blame any club for using social media to spread the news of their accomplishments. Heck last year with SSA won NPL in two age groups it was all over social media. What would you like for TH social media to do? Sample post: Congrats to player name1 (from CF, SSA) , and player name2 (born in South Alabama)... LOL. Reality is parents of players are the most influential in player accomplishments, not the club. Home grown is so subjective... I am not disagreeing about destination clubs. And, of course they are going to exploit number of kids they have on national team. I am merely saying that TH PR machine attributes its success to how well it develops kids. I think that's BS. Its recruiting abilities eclipse its development prowess. Folks with a more critical eye understand this. Snake oil was a saleable good for years as well. |
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Post by soccerlegacy on Jun 7, 2019 8:37:27 GMT -5
TH (and Concorde) are destination clubs. I cant blame any club for using social media to spread the news of their accomplishments. Heck last year with SSA won NPL in two age groups it was all over social media. What would you like for TH social media to do? Sample post: Congrats to player name1 (from CF, SSA) , and player name2 (born in South Alabama)... LOL. Reality is parents of players are the most influential in player accomplishments, not the club. Home grown is so subjective... I am not disagreeing about destination clubs. And, of course they are going to exploit number of kids they have on national team. I am merely saying that TH PR machine attributes its success to how well it develops kids. I think that's BS. Its recruiting abilities eclipse its development prowess. Folks with a more critical eye understand this. Snake oil was a saleable good for years as well. ... that should be their PR and marketing sales pitch! Haha...  |
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Post by Goalkeeper Dad on Jun 7, 2019 8:49:40 GMT -5
Sometimes I wonder about the lunitic fridge on this forum. Every club recruits and has girls move from club to club. It funny how many people put down Tophat because of their name and PR work. I do agree Tophat does do a great job on the PR but they are doing it to get the girls name out there so they can be scouted and get a look at by colleges. The more they promote the girls and teams the more college coaches will come. So the question I have is our you upset with Tophat with what they do or our you upset your Club doesn't do a better job of it? Maybe if your club did more of that maybe you would become a "Destination Club" for the more elite girls.
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shaka
Jr. Academy
Posts: 96
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Post by shaka on Jun 7, 2019 9:06:54 GMT -5
TH (and Concorde) are destination clubs. I cant blame any club for using social media to spread the news of their accomplishments. Heck last year with SSA won NPL in two age groups it was all over social media. What would you like for TH social media to do? Sample post: Congrats to player name1 (from CF, SSA) , and player name2 (born in South Alabama)... LOL. Reality is parents of players are the most influential in player accomplishments, not the club. Home grown is so subjective... I am not disagreeing about destination clubs. And, of course they are going to exploit number of kids they have on national team. I am merely saying that TH PR machine attributes its success to how well it develops kids. I think that's BS. Its recruiting abilities eclipse its development prowess. Folks with a more critical eye understand this. Snake oil was a saleable good for years as well. Their development in their Academy program surpasses any other clubs I’ve seen in this area. Don’t have a comment regarding the select age groups |
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Post by soccerlegacy on Jun 7, 2019 9:47:27 GMT -5
I am not disagreeing about destination clubs. And, of course they are going to exploit number of kids they have on national team. I am merely saying that TH PR machine attributes its success to how well it develops kids. I think that's BS. Its recruiting abilities eclipse its development prowess. Folks with a more critical eye understand this. Snake oil was a saleable good for years as well. Their development in their Academy program surpasses any other clubs I’ve seen in this area. Don’t have a comment regarding the select age groups TBH, their development in the academy is fine, but I wouldn't say it's superior to others. In fact, IMHO, the club with what I would consider the best development is not even one of the big 5, its Impact. I've had many people from other clubs comment and praise their players fundamentals and style of play. But they're a smaller club so many people don't know about them and they usually have their best players eventually leave to a destination club. One of the biggest reasons people don't go their is the location for it... it's too far for most to get there on a regular basis. |
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shaka
Jr. Academy
Posts: 96
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Post by shaka on Jun 7, 2019 10:03:33 GMT -5
Their development in their Academy program surpasses any other clubs I’ve seen in this area. Don’t have a comment regarding the select age groups TBH, their development in the academy is fine, but I wouldn't say it's superior to others. In fact, IMHO, the club with what I would consider the best development is not even one of the big 5, its Impact. I've had many people from other clubs comment and praise their players fundamentals and style of play. But they're a smaller club so many people don't know about them and they usually have their best players eventually leave to a destination club. One of the biggest reasons people don't go their is the location for it... it's too far for most to get there on a regular basis. Agreed on location. Cherokee county is not ideal :-) you mention it being a smaller club and that’s always a challenge. At the Academy ages, the more Physically advanced players aren’t challenged enough and go elsewhere. Even though everyone is developing technically the training environment is not competitive enough. Simply a Numbers issue. I’ve got Latino friends that have a great little club. My kids have trained with them & loved it but they had to train with older age groups Because the younger age groups don’t have enough high-level players to be competitive |
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Hard pass on the TH culture.
. It's still the Players, families choice to leave their clubs to go to TH. 
