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Post by Soccerhouse on Jun 4, 2015 8:11:25 GMT -5
So did adding RPL to u13 spring for girls, just destroy girls soccer in georgia? Lets be honest, the ECNL clubs have a major advantage starting at u13 as they begin to form pre-ecnl teams etc. Most are obviously already top tier teams in the state regardless and are large clubs with an advantage already due to size and reputation. But now, at u13, if they finish top 4 in the fall they earn RPL, so the following year, they have like whats going on right now an ECNL and RPL slot. Sounds like these clubs are basically creating "new" teams to fill the RPL slots vs using the current rostered players. Sorry to beat a dead horse, but now they can sell 30+ spots to kids, 15 of which are probably new players for the rpl team. Am I missing something here??? how will the smaller clubs compete. Its only going to get worse the next few years, and I think it will even be harder than ever for the smaller clubs to retain players. ECNL is obviously a huge carrot to dangle, now they can also dangle the RPL apple. Yes, it has to be earned, but as of today, the 4 ecnl rising 14s will also have rpl teams. I might be crazy, but DA does not seem to create this much craziness on the boys side, am I wrong? thoughts??? please slam me also if i'm way off base? ?? I can take it! I need to be yelled out this morning after this week.....
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Post by sidelinemama on Jun 4, 2015 8:59:44 GMT -5
It certainly appears to have added fuel to the fire. If RPL did it to try to compete with ECNL, their plan has backfired. Maybe their decision had nothing to do with ECNL, but it has definitely made a mess of things.
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Post by stevieg on Jun 4, 2015 9:07:33 GMT -5
I've been saying this all year. I don't understand the logic, at least here in GA. I'm not sure how U13 tryouts went, but I can guess that the ECNL clubs drew larger numbers based on what happened this past season. While my daughter may benefit in the short term as we are at an ECNL club, I think it will concentrate the best players at those 4 clubs and hurt the smaller or non-ECNL clubs.
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Post by jash on Jun 4, 2015 9:29:59 GMT -5
Which team, ECNL or RPL, will be the 'better' team at a club that has both? Will they try to make them even?
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Post by stevieg on Jun 4, 2015 9:45:15 GMT -5
ECNL is the top team in all cases. Hearing that Top Hat may not keep the RPL team after all, but no confirmation on that from anyone official. The wrinkle is that they have to keep 9 from the U13 RPL team on the roster of the U14 RPL team. Some will just drop down if new ECNL players come in, some will probably be double rostered so that the RPL team may have 22 on the roster, but 16-17 that actually travel and play.
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Post by greenmonkey on Jun 4, 2015 9:58:12 GMT -5
I'm not in this fray yet so my question is basic ... My understanding is only 4 clubs can "compete" in the ECNL league ... TH, CF, AFU and GSA? Which clubs can "compete" at RPL? Is it the same four clubs or are there more clubs as well. And is my understanding that RPL is by "invite" only year to year based on the prior years team "earning" the RPL spot by finishing well enough? So in "theory" (are we tired of my air quotes yet) If a LARGE club (UFA, CF, etc) has an ECNL team and a RPL team then wouldn't they also still have as many Athena teams as they still have players to play? Help me understand how adding more teams is bad? Ultimately isn't the "goal" for every girl that wants to play to have a team available at her level of play? Or maybe I'm drinking too much of the glass half full kool-aid. I'm sure someone can add some vinegar to my sweetness GM
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Post by stevieg on Jun 4, 2015 10:08:46 GMT -5
The issue is this: In prior years, RPL qualification was from the fall of U14 Athena play, in which the second teams of the ECNL clubs usually competed, not the top ECNL squad (putting aside the double rostering etc. that goes on). So, it was more difficult for the ECNL clubs to get and keep RPL status because they were starting at a somewhat disadvantage to UFA, NASA, SSA, etc. Now, they can get that RPL status using their top team in the fall of U13 Athena play, thus making it easier to attain and probably easier to keep as they become a "destination" for both ECNL and RPL. After all, would you prefer to try out at SSA for the RPL team or try out at CF, AFU, TH, GSA for the ECNL team and still have RPL to fall back on if you don't make the top team?
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Post by greenmonkey on Jun 4, 2015 10:42:53 GMT -5
Aha so now I understand
So it seems to me the real issue comes back to the craziness of how tryouts are scheduled ...
Because yes if my daughter wanted to try for ECNL then yes I would drive to the "destination" club
but if she isn't ECNL or RPL team ... I would then prefer to try out closer to home ...
But with tryouts all the same 3-4 days mostly all at the same times that starts to funnel your decision into it makes more "sense" to try out a one club and have the "guarantee" of at least having a spot on a team
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Post by SoccerMom on Jun 4, 2015 12:31:28 GMT -5
Aha so now I understand So it seems to me the real issue comes back to the craziness of how tryouts are scheduled ... Because yes if my daughter wanted to try for ECNL then yes I would drive to the "destination" club but if she isn't ECNL or RPL team ... I would then prefer to try out closer to home ... But with tryouts all the same 3-4 days mostly all at the same times that starts to funnel your decision into it makes more "sense" to try out a one club and have the "guarantee" of at least having a spot on a team CF did their ECNL tryouts in the morning unlike the other 3 Im hearing tho...that the ECNL teams may not be able to field an RPL team as well after all...I have heard this about 2 of the 4 clubs. I guess we wait and see what happens RPL includes FL, TN , AL, SC & NC
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Post by greenmonkey on Jun 4, 2015 12:45:25 GMT -5
r][/quote]CF did their ECNL tryouts in the morning unlike the other 3 Im hearing tho...that the ECNL teams may not be able to field an RPL team as well after all...I have heard this about 2 of the 4 clubs. I guess we wait and see what happens RPL includes FL, TN , AL, SC & NC[/quote] Bravo Zulu to CF for morning tryouts ... Yes for the working parent that must have been a nightmare but 3 clubs per day after work can't be a thrill either ... Also thanks StrikerMom .... I Found the link to RPL qualifiers www.georgiasoccer.org/region_3_premier_league_georgia_qualifiers/
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Post by SoccerMom on Jun 4, 2015 12:53:15 GMT -5
r] Bravo Zulu to CF for morning tryouts ... Yes for the working parent that must have been a nightmare but 3 clubs per day after work can't be a thrill either ... I've tried to figure out myself with no success ... How does one find out which teams at which clubs have been offered a spot in RPL ? GM [/quote] Only the ECNL teams had morning tryouts..the rest in the afternoon...for the working parent i think it REALLY sucks. I like the evening tryouts after work myself but also I have only attended tryouts at 1 club. The RPL teams list was posted this morning on the Georgia soccer website
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Post by Soccerhouse on Jun 4, 2015 12:59:48 GMT -5
Wonder if since the list is up now as being "official" will even more madness occur tonight?
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Post by SoccerMom on Jun 4, 2015 13:24:50 GMT -5
Wonder if since the list is up now as being "official" will even more madness occur tonight? everyone knew who made it in their age group before the list was even up.
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Post by guest on Jun 4, 2015 15:18:10 GMT -5
At first when I heard our team was applying for R3PL, I thought that was pretty much impossible. We did well in athena a and SC but there were several teams ahead of us, including the ones who were r3pl in the Spring.
Then I read on here something about teams having to pick either ecnl vs r3pl, or some team 'imploding' or not accepting the r3pl invite. I started having some hopes again. Then yesterday I saw the list of invitees (not us!). Several of those team were the ones I have read something about not being able to field a r3pl team.
Now I am just completely confused. Will the posted list change based on teams that choose or cannot field ecnl and r3pl? Do we still have a shot?
I feel like jerome boateng after messi got through with him.
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Post by SoccerMom on Jun 4, 2015 15:27:31 GMT -5
At first when I heard our team was applying for R3PL, I thought that was pretty much impossible. We did well in athena a and SC but there were several teams ahead of us, including the ones who were r3pl in the Spring. Then I read on here something about teams having to pick either ecnl vs r3pl, or some team 'imploding' or not accepting the r3pl invite. I started having some hopes again. Then yesterday I saw the list of invitees (not us!). Several of those team were the ones I have read something about not being able to field a r3pl team. Now I am just completely confused. Will the posted list change based on teams that choose or cannot field ecnl and r3pl? Do we still have a shot? I feel like jerome boateng after messi got through with him. If someone turns a spot down then yes its next in line
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Post by Soccerhouse on Jun 4, 2015 15:30:47 GMT -5
Ironically for many the coin is flipped and the player is in control vs the coach
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Post by crazymom312 on Jun 5, 2015 15:32:24 GMT -5
Question? Can one team play both ECNL and RPL? Is that allowed?
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Post by SoccerMom on Jun 5, 2015 19:41:32 GMT -5
Question? Can one team play both ECNL and RPL? Is that allowed? Yes as long as they can show roster continuity
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Post by Soccerhouse on Jun 11, 2015 11:26:26 GMT -5
So in theory a club could earn a RPL spot and then the following year as long as they kept their place, give the rpl "spot" to a rec team? obviously, I'm kidding, but how can you have to earn RPL, then not have to maintain any roster continuity.
They just watered down RPL with weaker teams, am I crazy? (Yes, I know I'm crazy....)
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Post by stevieg on Jun 11, 2015 12:16:37 GMT -5
So in theory a club could earn a RPL spot and then the following year as long as they kept their place, give the rpl "spot" to a rec team? obviously, I'm kidding, but how can you have to earn RPL, then not have to maintain any roster continuity. They just watered down RPL with weaker teams, am I crazy? (Yes, I know I'm crazy....) Assuming that GA didn't enforce roster continuity then yes. However, I think that most (not all) parents and coaches are realistic enough to know that an Athena B level team won't be able to compete in RPL and will not want to pay for all the travel and costs of that league. For example, at AFU, we have only 4 of last year's U13 second team (Athena B) that made the RPL team for U14. The rest are either players from this past spring's RPL team or from other clubs' Athena A teams. It seems that CF will also have a strong RPL team with many of last season's U13 Elite not making the ECNL team there. TopHat likely attracted some good players for its RPL team and have some Gold players stay on that team (as the Navy team was not good enough to compete in RPL). The only question mark is GSA, as the Red team was not good enough to compete in RPL, so it depends on who they added.
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Post by guest on Jun 12, 2015 12:19:28 GMT -5
So in theory a club could earn a RPL spot and then the following year as long as they kept their place, give the rpl "spot" to a rec team? obviously, I'm kidding, but how can you have to earn RPL, then not have to maintain any roster continuity. They just watered down RPL with weaker teams, am I crazy? (Yes, I know I'm crazy....) Assuming that GA didn't enforce roster continuity then yes. However, I think that most (not all) parents and coaches are realistic enough to know that an Athena B level team won't be able to compete in RPL and will not want to pay for all the travel and costs of that league. For example, at AFU, we have only 4 of last year's U13 second team (Athena B) that made the RPL team for U14. The rest are either players from this past spring's RPL team or from other clubs' Athena A teams. It seems that CF will also have a strong RPL team with many of last season's U13 Elite not making the ECNL team there. TopHat likely attracted some good players for its RPL team and have some Gold players stay on that team (as the Navy team was not good enough to compete in RPL). The only question mark is GSA, as the Red team was not good enough to compete in RPL, so it depends on who they added. Good explanation thanks. This makes me think that AFU has essentially created another team. One is made up how you described; some stayed on the team, some moved up from Athena B and some added from other clubs. But AFU also has an ECNL team now too, right? How does that team get created? Is that the rest of the Spring RPL players plus some new adds? Is that the only way to keep both an ECNL team and an RPL team is to add a bunch of players? "Assuming that GA didn't enforce roster continuity" What is the rule for this? I have heard this before but is this a percentage or a number of players? Just trying to see how it all works.
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Post by SoccerMom on Jun 12, 2015 12:33:36 GMT -5
Assuming that GA didn't enforce roster continuity then yes. However, I think that most (not all) parents and coaches are realistic enough to know that an Athena B level team won't be able to compete in RPL and will not want to pay for all the travel and costs of that league. For example, at AFU, we have only 4 of last year's U13 second team (Athena B) that made the RPL team for U14. The rest are either players from this past spring's RPL team or from other clubs' Athena A teams. It seems that CF will also have a strong RPL team with many of last season's U13 Elite not making the ECNL team there. TopHat likely attracted some good players for its RPL team and have some Gold players stay on that team (as the Navy team was not good enough to compete in RPL). The only question mark is GSA, as the Red team was not good enough to compete in RPL, so it depends on who they added. Good explanation thanks. This makes me think that AFU has essentially created another team. One is made up how you described; some stayed on the team, some moved up from Athena B and some added from other clubs. But AFU also has an ECNL team now too, right? How does that team get created? Is that the rest of the Spring RPL players plus some new adds? Is that the only way to keep both an ECNL team and an RPL team is to add a bunch of players? "Assuming that GA didn't enforce roster continuity" What is the rule for this? I have heard this before but is this a percentage or a number of players? Just trying to see how it all works. Yes to your question about ECNL team 9 player continuity is the rule
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Post by guest on Jun 12, 2015 12:44:12 GMT -5
So if there are 4 'new' ECNL teams now for Fall, and you assume 15 players per team, that means 60 players have to move into those ECNL clubs. At least in order to grow the one Spring RPL team into two Fall teams (one RPL and one ECNL). That's a lot of moving pieces. I can see now why multiple tryouts and club-swapping is such a big deal these days. Glad we don't do that with what school you go to.
I guess now the question is once you're in RPL are you there forever? Does anyone ever get relegated out of RPL or promoted up from Athena A?
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Post by SoccerMom on Jun 12, 2015 14:20:48 GMT -5
So if there are 4 'new' ECNL teams now for Fall, and you assume 15 players per team, that means 60 players have to move into those ECNL clubs. At least in order to grow the one Spring RPL team into two Fall teams (one RPL and one ECNL). That's a lot of moving pieces. I can see now why multiple tryouts and club-swapping is such a big deal these days. Glad we don't do that with what school you go to. I guess now the question is once you're in RPL are you there forever? Does anyone ever get relegated out of RPL or promoted up from Athena A? There is dual rostering between ECNL and RPL for some teams You can get relegated from RPL back to Athena and promoted from Athena A to RPL. There is 2 divisions of RPL
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Post by stevieg on Jun 12, 2015 15:02:43 GMT -5
Unfortunately there is no roster continuity rule for Georgia or Region 3. It is an assumed consideration, but there is nothing in writing anywhere outside of the National League application process that mentions roster continuity. So yes, a club could put together a brand new team consisting of whatever players they want and put them in RPL if they decide to. CF is essentially doing that with their rising U14 girls RPL slot. The Central team won the RPL slot with their fall finish, but the RPL team in the fall will only have a few of those players in it. SSA is doing the same with their rising U16 girls. They have no players returning from the U15 team that won the RPL slot at State Cup. They will put their lower team in RPL as a result. Several clubs are doing the same on the boys side for different reasons. KSA, Concorde, SSA, and a couple others. Actually CF U14G did not win the RPL slot with their fall finish. They were 5th. They won it with their Spring Athena A win (and the fact that the State Cup final 4 had already qualified from the fall), but quite a few of those players will be playing RPL as the new coach recruited outside players for the ECNL squad.
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Post by stevieg on Jun 12, 2015 15:20:52 GMT -5
Sorry. You're right. Spring finish. The RPL group will be mainly the old Norh team, plus a sprinkling of former Central players and newcomers. That's not what I heard. Many of the old North team have scattered elsewhere (at least 3 went to AFU and 4 went to Roswell). About 9 of the old elite team didn't make the ECNL roster and I think most stayed to play RPL.
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Post by Soccerhouse on Jun 12, 2015 15:25:32 GMT -5
Sorry. You're right. Spring finish. The RPL group will be mainly the old Norh team, plus a sprinkling of former Central players and newcomers. That's not what I heard. Many of the old North team have scattered elsewhere (at least 3 went to AFU and 4 went to Roswell). About 9 of the old elite team didn't make the ECNL roster and I think most stayed to play RPL. Wow 9! well at least they are doing what is "ethically" correct and forming a RPL team of the girls that earned the spot. (even if they weren't selected for the ECNL team). I know I'm a broken record, but man what an ugly tryout for the rising u14 age group. Watch out rising u13s, you guys are next!!!
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Post by guest on Jun 12, 2015 16:19:12 GMT -5
Sorry. You're right. Spring finish. The RPL group will be mainly the old Norh team, plus a sprinkling of former Central players and newcomers. That's not what I heard. Many of the old North team have scattered elsewhere (at least 3 went to AFU and 4 went to Roswell). About 9 of the old elite team didn't make the ECNL roster and I think most stayed to play RPL. That's what I can't wrap my brain around. You have 14 girls playing on a club's top team in Spring and 9 of them don't make the team for Fall. They are essentially 'relegated' to the 2nd team. And the description of the North team is similar. 'Many have scattered'. Heck of a way to run a railroad. Seems like how Liberty Media Group handles the Braves. Must be odd at 13 years old to come to your first practice and hardly know anyone on your team.
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Post by stevieg on Jun 12, 2015 16:55:16 GMT -5
I think that happens a lot at this age group. When the ECNL teams form at U14, they attract a lot of people who were playing a local clubs to drive a little further. This has had a ripple effect on the RPL teams at those clubs as well. At CF, 7 of the elite team made the ECNL team (there were 18 on the roster in Spring i think). My daughter only has 3 of her old teammates on her new team, but 2 girls she played with at U11 and U12 also moved and made the team. Plus a lot of these kids know each other from ODP, Super Y, indoor, etc.
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Post by Soccerhouse on Jun 12, 2015 17:21:08 GMT -5
Any kids not make either the ecnl or rpl team that were on the elite team?
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