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Post by soccerparent02 on Oct 9, 2016 15:31:30 GMT -5
Just curious. We did as most seem to...we left a small club for one of the larger Atlanta area clubs. Our child was very competitive at the small club team wise and made the top team at their new club and now playing a region schedule. Does this happen to most small clubs around U12 to U14? How can small clubs continue to lose the talent they develop and be a relevant club in Georgia soccer?
I look forward to everyone's thoughts.
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Post by soccerfan30 on Oct 9, 2016 15:36:43 GMT -5
It typically happens at U13/U14 when players look to be surrounded by players of like ability and commitment. I was at DOC at a small club for four years, we had a great deal of success, the biggest obstacle I faced was the organization didn't want to emphasize select soccer and there just wasn't enough depth on each of the teams where at a bigger club players 1-15 would be similar in ability at a small club you may have varying levels of ability on every team.
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Post by rifle on Oct 9, 2016 16:16:29 GMT -5
Just curious. We did as most seem to...we left a small club for one of the larger Atlanta area clubs. Our child was very competitive at the small club team wise and made the top team at their new club and now playing a region schedule. Does this happen to most small clubs around U12 to U14? How can small clubs continue to lose the talent they develop and be a relevant club in Georgia soccer? I look forward to everyone's thoughts. It does indeed happen at that age. In my opinion, the only difference is the size of the player pool. A small pool will yield fewer top shelf players. (Small club teams don't get placed as high in Select because of this simple fact). Mix in early puberty, and the "range" of apparent player quality gets stretched even further. If a small club is good at teaching players to play, then I would suggest they're doing great work. Highly "relevant". It typically happens at U13/U14 when players look to be surrounded by players of like ability and commitment. I was at DOC at a small club for four years, we had a great deal of success, the biggest obstacle I faced was the organization didn't want to emphasize select soccer and there just wasn't enough depth on each of the teams where at a bigger club players 1-15 would be similar in ability at a small club you may have varying levels of ability on every team. Ton of truth here. Parents see a vast range of skill level on a team, and the best ones head for the hills.
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Post by newposter on Oct 9, 2016 18:00:04 GMT -5
I agree. We left a small club. You are correct. The depth of the players on the team was lacking. The top 6-8 were as good as any but playing 11 v 11 we struggled when players 12 to 16 came in. We appreciate the training we got there but had to move. Our children's former teams have dropped to classic III.
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Post by rifle on Oct 9, 2016 19:49:59 GMT -5
I've said it before.. I think small clubs should celebrate kids who leave and make top teams at other clubs. Embrace the success of preparing them well.
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Post by alacrity174 on Oct 10, 2016 7:23:16 GMT -5
Good topic.
As a former coach as a small club I always knew my top players would end up on a bigger clubs teams. Obviously I had mixed feelings about this but for those that did make it onto top regional/ Classic teams I was always happy, I still see these players and will always speak with them and their parents to see how they are getting on. The only down side is the players that were left only ever had the option of CL III level as that is where GA Soccer puts small clubs.
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Post by TheMadOx on Oct 10, 2016 7:52:36 GMT -5
I was also a small club coach and had children that played at the same club. I also celebrated (with mixed emotions) when players left for top teams at the bigger clubs. I eventually just took pride in developing talent for the other clubs. I will say that players are leaving earlier due to the structure of academy...it's getting tougher for the small clubs to crack the "alliance" scheduling that occurs with the large clubs. If we were fortunate to get one of the big clubs to play us, they would send their 2nd or 3rd team to play our team. We moved on to the bigger club to challenge my kids to play against the other bigger clubs. I love the small club environment, but long term, I think there is more value playing the best of the best each week.
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Post by spectator on Oct 10, 2016 8:16:02 GMT -5
Well - we did it backwards. We were at a mega club for years, moved to a small club based on a recommendation about a coach there and could not be happier with the transition. Granted we made the move at an older age rather than those 'formative' years in early Classic/Athena. For us, it's been the best move ever made - it was all my player's choice and this coach has been instrumental in getting all the players college looks and visits. Several players have already verbally committed and most others are still in the process. And no, we're not ECNL so you really don't have to fall for that hype and chase down those clubs unless you want to be part of that team and that coach available to your player.
Point being - the coach your player gets is far far more important than the club.
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Post by rifle on Oct 10, 2016 10:09:27 GMT -5
A red flag was for me was the small club scheduling academy games during ODP tryouts (and never mentioning those tryouts).. All while claiming to be doing what's best for each player. You will find in club soccer that talk is cheap.
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Post by jash on Oct 10, 2016 10:20:10 GMT -5
It isn't always the best for players to leave. Extended travel time, poorer nutrition (eating in the car which WILL end up happening despite your best planning), less time for homework, higher stress levels, and sometimes less playing time (or even being left at home on 23-man rosters) -- these can and do happen.
Every situation is different, and if you're clearly a DA level player and have any realistic shot at a career in soccer, then you should go -- immediately, no questions asked.
If you're simply one of the better players at your local small club, it might not be in your best interest to leave for many reasons.
Finally, I know in our case that if players had not been leaving in ones and twos over the last few years, we'd have one of the strongest teams in the select system. It can become a self-fulfilling prophecy, and it's often simply ego driven, and sadly it's often the parents' egos driving it.
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Post by jash on Oct 10, 2016 10:23:22 GMT -5
I will also say this. I have talked to many players who I have known over the years who decided to leave and drive over an hour one-way for a 'better' experience. The majority of them say, if they had to do it over again, they would not.
The realities of not having any real future in soccer after all of that time invested hits hard. They almost universally said the experience was not significantly better, and they missed playing with their friends.
There's a lot to consider, and being realistic about your future is a huge start.
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Post by touchlinedad on Oct 10, 2016 10:30:22 GMT -5
As a parent who has always been at a small club, if a player leaves of his own volition to join a larger club, that's fine. The issue I have is with recruiting. I have been in situations where coaches have gone straight to parents and told them they could get their child a college scholarship so the child would change clubs. They aren't looking to develop the player, they are just looking to win. In my opinion, that is unethical and wrong. I accept that a certain amount of recruiting goes on but it should be based on the merit of the club and its coaches, not false promises of college scholarships at U13/U14.
I also think that Georgia Soccer, when looking at Select placement, should not assume that a small club is only going to have Classic II and lower teams. Typically, the UFA/Concorde Fire-size clubs have a Classic 1 team in every age bracket. But a small club can have a Classic 1 team at U13, a Classic II team at U14, a Classic IV team at U15, etc. I truly hope that small clubs are not discriminated against just because of size.
I also think the larger clubs would do well not to assume that just because a club is smaller, that all their Academy teams are weak. TheMadOx is right, it is difficult to play against top teams due to scheduling. Concorde or UFA might at six U10 teams whereas a smaller club might have two or three. However, that small club's top U10 team might be just as good as Concorde's top team and the larger clubs should be aware of that. I bet some of them are because they are already looking for talent to recruit.
Finally, it would be a huge drain for my family to try and play at a big club simply due to travel time. Yes, I want my child to be pushed to get better and to play against the best. But I have to weigh that against spending so much time stuck in the car on 285 trying to get to practice.
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Post by Keeper on Oct 10, 2016 12:13:38 GMT -5
Well - we did it backwards. We were at a mega club for years, moved to a small club based on a recommendation about a coach there and could not be happier with the transition. Granted we made the move at an older age rather than those 'formative' years in early Classic/Athena. For us, it's been the best move ever made - it was all my player's choice and this coach has been instrumental in getting all the players college looks and visits. Several players have already verbally committed and most others are still in the process. And no, we're not ECNL so you really don't have to fall for that hype and chase down those clubs unless you want to be part of that team and that coach available to your player. Point being - the coach your player gets is far far more important than the club. I'm with you! As a coach at a medium sized club it's amazing to see all these players come to us or smaller clubs in their Hs days because they want to have fun and still get great coaching. Just the other day I ran into a former player who left for Concordes Athena A team and the first words out of her mouth were "I made a mistake, I can't wait till tryouts again." I mean it's hit or miss but no club is the all mighty awesome. Look for a great coach, not for a great politician.
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Post by spectator on Oct 10, 2016 13:33:30 GMT -5
A red flag was for me was the small club scheduling academy games during ODP tryouts (and never mentioning those tryouts).. All while claiming to be doing what's best for each player. You will find in club soccer that talk is cheap. This happens with lower level teams at all clubs though. When were were at mega club, they didn't even send info out about ODP to any team below Classic 1/Athena A.
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Post by goteam on Oct 13, 2016 18:53:31 GMT -5
Having come from a large club for many years, I witnessed kids mostly moving into the club from smaller ones around u12/u13 .(1/2 come from club poaching than actually developing players)
Kids / Parents say they want to join these clubs because they want to play where the talent is and that their kid can play rpl,encl, class I etc. I can flat out testify for every good coach there are 8 crappy ones(and i mean crappy). So I guess your child "might" be happy.... hiding in a slew of more athletic players and win some games against some decent teams but you are not guaranteed in anyway your child will develop as a player and be happy. Our large club attracted talent not because they develop or have consistent outstanding coaching but because good players were attracted to playing with other good players and they know they will find it.
We moved to a smaller club and although our child is not on as high of a quality team or playing as high of a level as he would have should we have stayed we can say that he has the best coaching he has ever had. He (and we) are very happy. Yes, we'd love to see him have at the best of the best but we'll settle for a coach who knows how to teach the game but I don't regret watching 70 minutes of whack a ball all while the coach(s) think they are the sh*t.
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Post by newposter on Oct 13, 2016 19:22:58 GMT -5
We have been extremely happy with the big club coach. In fact we left in part because of the coaches reputation for training and teaching. I believe also that in some cases coaches leave smaller clubs too for financial reasons. More resources more money to pay coaches. Each parent had to make the best decision for their player and in our case we involved our child in this decision.
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Post by rifle on Oct 13, 2016 20:52:46 GMT -5
Coach pay, coach quality and club size are independent variables.
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Post by controlaltdelete on Oct 14, 2016 9:46:00 GMT -5
I've said it before.. I think small clubs should celebrate kids who leave and make top teams at other clubs. Embrace the success of preparing them well. We left our original small club after years of great coaching and fun times! The DOC and directors/owners are always pleased to see the success of our son! From the age of 7 they watched him grow and develop! He's been a State Cup Finalist and this years current State Cup Champs, he's played 2 seasons RPL till the age group mandate changes, he's currently on a top Classic I. As a parent and TM for many years I will always hold our former small club in high esteem and think of them with fond memories.
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