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Post by Soccerhouse on Jun 5, 2018 10:23:36 GMT -5
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Post by rifle on Jun 5, 2018 20:23:28 GMT -5
Pay to play excludes 85% of willing competitors. We're doing it wrong.
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Post by girlsoccer on Jun 5, 2018 20:35:55 GMT -5
Pay to play excludes 85% of willing competitors. We're doing it wrong. Can you think of an example of a sport that isn’t expensive at the highest levels of competition?
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Post by rifle on Jun 5, 2018 21:10:45 GMT -5
Pay to play excludes 85% of willing competitors. We're doing it wrong. Can you think of an example of a sport that isn’t expensive at the highest levels of competition? Sure. One called football in most of the world. We're doing it wrong.
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Post by mistergrinch on Jun 5, 2018 21:36:52 GMT -5
Can you think of an example of a sport that isn’t expensive at the highest levels of competition? Sure. One called football in most of the world. We're doing it wrong. Someone pays for that. In the countries with good youth programs, it's the professional clubs. They have the money to do so.
Here? Pro soccer is still in its infancy and doesn't make the kind of money to pay for massive academies. Also, those other countries mostly ignore girls, so there's that.
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Post by be real on Jun 5, 2018 21:44:32 GMT -5
Money is only part of the problem. America doesn't have a monopoly on ghettos, slums, or barrios. There are poor people in all places. Difference is the rest of the world don't need manicured fields before kids go play their futbol. Their passion overcomes the obstacles. I'm sure there's plenty of poor kids out there that play football, basketball, baseball in the streets. Why? Because there's passion there. Until America becomes as passionate about soccer, America won't be competing at the highest level.
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Post by Soccerhouse on Jun 5, 2018 22:01:54 GMT -5
I personally think that many of these basketball players and football players are freakish athletes. Crazy athleticism. If these kids played soccer at a young age and continue to refined their skills - would be a dangerous combination. Many have work ethics that are unparalleled and are perfectionist and the ultimate competitors.
Yes doesn’t necessarily equate to Soccer skills and IQ.
Problem is why would these kids give up hoops or football for soccer, ain’t happening.
These kids are being drafted for baseball etc, crazy athletes.
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Post by mistergrinch on Jun 5, 2018 22:11:29 GMT -5
I personally think that many of these basketball players and football players are freakish athletes. Crazy athleticism. If these kids played soccer at a young age and continue to refined their skills - would be a dangerous combination. Many have work ethics that are unparalleled and are perfectionist and the ultimate competitors. Yes doesn’t necessarily equate to Soccer skills and IQ. Problem is why would these kids give up hoops or football for soccer, ain’t happening. These kids are being drafted for baseball etc, crazy athletes.
2 things... money and fame.
If you're a kid in the US, you can dream of being rich and famous playing football, basketball, baseball... to be rich and famous in soccer, you have to leave the country.
When (if) MLS becomes a BIG sport in the US -selling out stadiums (other than AU, of course) and paying millions to the players - big TV contracts and not having to wait until football is over to have their season... THEN we'll see top athletes going to soccer.
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Post by guest on Jun 6, 2018 5:43:04 GMT -5
These were two thought provoking articles and I’m glad you posted them. Thank you, keep it up.
But the substance of the articles was bad in so many different ways. Lots of opinion, lots of improper comparisons to how it’s done elsewhere, improper conclusions drawn that suggest the reason America isn’t good at soccer is that we really just a bunch of racists. After reading this article you would be excused for thinking that there are hordes of black kids just itching to play soccer but rich white folks won’t let them on the fields.
The Guardian is looking so far down their nose at us, I’m surprised they can even see us down here!
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Post by rifle on Jun 6, 2018 5:58:51 GMT -5
Sure. One called football in most of the world. We're doing it wrong. Someone pays for that. In the countries with good youth programs, it's the professional clubs. They have the money to do so.
Here? Pro soccer is still in its infancy and doesn't make the kind of money to pay for massive academies. Also, those other countries mostly ignore girls, so there's that.
Bingo. Professional clubs. When your federation actively suppresses professional soccer - limited to a handful of NFL billionaires, it's a problem. blog.3four3.com/2015/09/14/pay-to-play-and-the-link-to-promotion-relegation/
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Post by be real on Jun 6, 2018 6:38:55 GMT -5
Someone pays for that. In the countries with good youth programs, it's the professional clubs. They have the money to do so.
Here? Pro soccer is still in its infancy and doesn't make the kind of money to pay for massive academies. Also, those other countries mostly ignore girls, so there's that.
Bingo. Professional clubs. When your federation actively suppresses professional soccer - limited to a handful of NFL billionaires, it's a problem. blog.3four3.com/2015/09/14/pay-to-play-and-the-link-to-promotion-relegation/Don't subscribe to the thought that MLS is not making money. Rather think that MLS doesn't believe that academies are worth it, academies don't produce players. Therefore why invest? MLS would rather bring young South American players or old euro players. College is going that route too with young internationals.
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Post by girlsoccer on Jun 6, 2018 6:40:15 GMT -5
Can you think of an example of a sport that isn’t expensive at the highest levels of competition? Sure. One called football in most of the world. We're doing it wrong. Fair enough. I meant another sport in the US that could be used as an example? I can’t think of one. I know high level baseball, basketball are quite expensive (no personal experience with football). If the kids are passionate and talented the parents seem to find a way to make it happen. I think the issue here in the US of racial disparity has more to do with a lack of interest in soccer. We need to find a Tiger Woods of soccer to help motivate and inspire kids that otherwise gravitate toward other sports.
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Post by daddyo on Jun 6, 2018 7:03:30 GMT -5
I've seen a lot of kids from the streets that could ball, picked up by a club and get a free ride. Some people get angry at this but I think it's great for the kid from a soccer standpoint because he will get to play at a high level, without the additional financial strain on his family.
I remember when a Particular coach got extremely upset with BK recruiting these boys from Soccer in the Streets to play for him. The Particular coach was upset because he believed these kids should be focusing on adjusting to Life in America and focusing on grades and school because soccer would end when they aged out. If they didn't focus on their studies now, they may not graduate from HS and have the opportunity to attend college, trade schools. etc
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Post by Soccerhouse on Jun 6, 2018 8:28:58 GMT -5
Here is the difference also, kids that play football are doing off season workouts everyday this summer - 7:45 to 10ish. Weight room then onto the field, granted they didn't play football in the spring -- but how many soccer players do you know are working out every day?
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Post by soccerlegacy on Jun 6, 2018 9:08:22 GMT -5
I personally think that many of these basketball players and football players are freakish athletes. Crazy athleticism. If these kids played soccer at a young age and continue to refined their skills - would be a dangerous combination. Many have work ethics that are unparalleled and are perfectionist and the ultimate competitors. Yes doesn’t necessarily equate to Soccer skills and IQ. Problem is why would these kids give up hoops or football for soccer, ain’t happening. These kids are being drafted for baseball etc, crazy athletes. True. But just because a player is an athletic "stud" in one of the other sports (i.e. football, basketball, baseball, etc), doesn't necessarily mean they would be just as accomplished in soccer.
I played soccer, football, and basketball growing up... and from my vantage point were many players I knew that were really good in one, and just average in the others. There are other intangibles and variances that help to create a good player in a particular sport.
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Post by be real on Jun 6, 2018 11:33:58 GMT -5
I personally think that many of these basketball players and football players are freakish athletes. Crazy athleticism. If these kids played soccer at a young age and continue to refined their skills - would be a dangerous combination. Many have work ethics that are unparalleled and are perfectionist and the ultimate competitors. Yes doesn’t necessarily equate to Soccer skills and IQ. Problem is why would these kids give up hoops or football for soccer, ain’t happening. These kids are being drafted for baseball etc, crazy athletes. True. But just because a player is an athletic "stud" in one of the other sports (i.e. football, basketball, baseball, etc), doesn't necessarily mean they would be just as accomplished in soccer.
I played soccer, football, and basketball growing up... and from my vantage point were many players I knew that were really good in one, and just average in the others. There are other intangibles and variances that help to create a good player in a particular sport.
I'm still amazed that America is pining for the "athletes" in other American sports to play soccer. We have more than enough "athletes" playing soccer but not many true "soccer" players.
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Post by atlfutboldad on Jun 6, 2018 13:06:40 GMT -5
These were two thought provoking articles and I’m glad you posted them. Thank you, keep it up. But the substance of the articles was bad in so many different ways. Lots of opinion, lots of improper comparisons to how it’s done elsewhere, improper conclusions drawn that suggest the reason America isn’t good at soccer is that we really just a bunch of racists. After reading this article you would be excused for thinking that there are hordes of black kids just itching to play soccer but rich white folks won’t let them on the fields. The Guardian is looking so far down their nose at us, I’m surprised they can even see us down here! We're white racists but... "By now, he knows the stereotypes of immigrant soccer leagues: that they won’t pay; that players bring their families and stay all day with coolers of food; that they leave the fields a mess." I'm guessing that the park owners didn't just "come up with" this stereotype. So yeah, if they've been burned before, the burden is on the new guy wanting to establish himself. Just like a car dealership or anywhere else you're dealing with a good bit of money.
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Post by atlfutboldad on Jun 6, 2018 13:10:04 GMT -5
Don't subscribe to the thought that MLS is not making money. Rather think that MLS doesn't believe that academies are worth it, academies don't produce players. Therefore why invest? MLS would rather bring young South American players or old euro players. College is going that route too with young internationals.
Not all the clubs have the financial backing and are doing as well as Atlanta and Toronto. MLS doesn't have the money deals of the NFL/NBA yet and there are plenty of fields where the stands are far from packed. But more of the clubs are *trying* to create academies to build talent from the ground up. Europe and South America only have what, several decades of experience ahead of us?
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