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Post by atlfutboldad on Sept 25, 2018 18:23:38 GMT -5
Personally, I'd rather have mine in at the end of the game than in at the beginning (if the game isn't out of control either way). In a tight game, the players in at the end have the most potential to prevent a loss or balance a tie or take the lead. A fast, rested player in at the end can change the complexion of a game.
Of course if its DA and you only get 3 subs (or whatever the rules are) a game and the goal isnt roughly equal playing time, I get it.
But if it bothers your boy that much, talk to the coach about playing at the beginning and end occasionally (assuming they can sub back in).
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Post by Keeper on Sept 25, 2018 20:51:00 GMT -5
In these games so far have you been winning? Losing? Blow outs or tight games? Pretty much if your son isn’t in the game when you’re in a tight must win game then the coach is just trying to appease you and your son. He/she have their favorites and your kid will just be a sub.
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Post by Futsal Gawdess on Sept 26, 2018 7:30:52 GMT -5
He comes in every game no matter if it is 0-0 1-0, doesn't matter. He changes the game. When he is in, we attack much more than when he is not. I understand all of that zico. I think the reason that was given as to why my son doesn't start is BS. I think the reason has to do with how the coach feels about my son, and it is a new coach this year who does not know him. My son has been a starter since age 5 and plays at the highest level. He is a midfielder with striker speed. He knows the game and has played since he could walk. Plays 3v3 every summer and has had some great coaches. I am not a blind parent. I have been around the game a long time. I know some kids are better some are worse. I understand. My son does everything that would make him a starter by his play, but the excuse, to me, seemed lame. I am of the belief it is what the coach sees rather than a game strategy. So that being said I think the reason given was BS. Unfortunately, soccer is such a subjective sport. Other than goals, assists, clean-sheets, the only other measure of rating a player is the eye test. I too think the reasoning is BS. So for what it's worth, it just looks like this coach doesn't rate your son high on his depth chart. I can't argue for or against his skill set since I've never seen him play. Soccer for Skills, Soccer for Life Skills. In addition to being mum and dad, we as parents are backup coaches, cheerleaders, sports psychologists, nurses, etc. It's time for you to put on your Cheerleader and Sports Psychologist hats. Use this as a teachable moment. In life you will come across those who rightfully or wrongfully don't think highly of you. Use the situation to reshape their thinking. Like someone else said most good players go through ups and downs in their career. Teach him to use this situation to grind harder and become such an impact player, that he changes the coach's mind and how he thinks of him. Remind him that even if this coach doesn't want him, how he handles this will follow him to his next team/coach. I know it hurts seeing you kid struggle with these kinds of issues. Just keep encouraging him to get better and good things will come his way. I wish you good luck with this.
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Post by soccerfan30 on Sept 26, 2018 10:18:43 GMT -5
... another opinion. If the coach is making substitutions more out of routine and not for other reasons. For example, substituting the same players, at the same time every game, and substituting 3-4 at a time. I don’t know if this is what’s going on, however, this is a lazy way to coach. Maybe the coach does that to ensure everyone plays at least 50% of the game
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Post by ilove8amgames on Sept 26, 2018 10:18:45 GMT -5
My kids have gone through this same scenario. It happens. If he/she is on a high-level team, the practices are worth it. Stay on this team, work harder, player talks to coach (not parent). That's all you can do.
Stay on the team. Steel sharpens steel.
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Post by Futsal Gawdess on Sept 26, 2018 11:42:26 GMT -5
... another opinion. If the coach is making substitutions more out of routine and not for other reasons. For example, substituting the same players, at the same time every game, and substituting 3-4 at a time. I don’t know if this is what’s going on, however, this is a lazy way to coach. Maybe the coach does that to ensure everyone plays at least 50% of the game I get that, but at least try to change up the starters every once in a while. Especially if the kid is giving 100%, reward his effort. Even the bright ones at US Soccer DA have a rule about guaranteed starting % and playing time
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Post by 4theloveofsoccer on Sept 27, 2018 9:42:01 GMT -5
I strongly do not agree with this but there are some coaches that only put in players for less than 5 minutes of the game, which can be end of half or end of game. What is the use for any kid to be on a team when they are getting this small amount of time. If a coach selects a player to be on the team, give them the time to develop in games as well. Playing half of a game I'm good with, but if the game is 45 min halves give the kid at least 10-15 minutes of playing time in the half.
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Post by forsythsd on Sept 27, 2018 14:19:26 GMT -5
And travel compounds the issue. Who wants to drive hours and pay for hotels for a few minutes of play? It sucks for the kid and the parents.
Such coaches spew the expected "we're all about development" line, but neglect to add "but only for half of the team."
If it's truly about development for all then playing time would be roughly equal for all kids that fully participate (attend all practices, show up on time, don't screw around, etc.). But when some kids always play the full game while others get 10-20 minutes, well, it's obvious some animals are more equal than others.
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Post by newposter on Sept 27, 2018 16:59:20 GMT -5
Not sure I would refer to kids as animals. No one here knows why the player is getting the minutes they get. The description is a parent view. I am as guilty as everyone when it comes to my kid. There have been times I thought they deserved more playing time but I always told him. He earned the time he got. If the parents not happy, find a new team or club next year. Have the kid practice hard, practice at home and stay sharp for tryouts in the spring.
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Post by oldboy on Sept 28, 2018 7:47:22 GMT -5
Not sure I would refer to kids as animals. No one here knows why the player is getting the minutes they get. The description is a parent view. I am as guilty as everyone when it comes to my kid. There have been times I thought they deserved more playing time but I always told him. He earned the time he got. If the parents not happy, find a new team or club next year. Have the kid practice hard, practice at home and stay sharp for tryouts in the spring. The poster is not calling kids animals. It’s a literary reference to George Orwell’s Animal Farm. Basically what the poster was saying is the coaches are being hypocrites. Just thought I’d clear that up.
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Post by soccerloafer on Sept 28, 2018 7:49:51 GMT -5
Not sure I would refer to kids as animals. No one here knows why the player is getting the minutes they get. The description is a parent view. I am as guilty as everyone when it comes to my kid. There have been times I thought they deserved more playing time but I always told him. He earned the time he got. If the parents not happy, find a new team or club next year. Have the kid practice hard, practice at home and stay sharp for tryouts in the spring. Animal reference is to George Orwell's novel warning about Communism - Animal Farm. The original motto of the collective farm is 'all animals are equal.' After one class takes over (the pigs, representing the elite party), the motto is changed to 'all animals are equal, some are more equal than others.' Kind of applies to politics today. Also see his novel 1984 for the original take on fake news.
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Post by mightydawg on Sept 28, 2018 8:13:10 GMT -5
In my experience, if you watch practice, you understand why some kids play more than others.
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Post by oraclesfriend on Sept 28, 2018 8:48:45 GMT -5
In my experience, if you watch practice, you understand why some kids play more than others. In my experience, this is true sometimes, but many times coaches do not seem to have any good reason to like a player or dislike one. Also there are coaches who make a decision at the beginning of the season or even tryouts about a player and are very stubborn about not changing that opinion even when ALL evidence (games, training sessions, fitness, etc) point out that their initial impression was incorrect. I think your statement is vastly oversimplified and implies that coaches are actually fair and unbiased. Our experience has been hit or miss there.
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Post by setpieces on Sept 28, 2018 9:28:13 GMT -5
In my experience, if you watch practice, you understand why some kids play more than others. In my experience, this is true sometimes, but many times coaches do not seem to have any good reason to like a player or dislike one. Also there are coaches who make a decision at the beginning of the season or even tryouts about a player and are very stubborn about not changing that opinion even when ALL evidence (games, training sessions, fitness, etc) point out that their initial impression was incorrect. I think your statement is vastly oversimplified and implies that coaches are actually fair and unbiased. Our experience has been hit or miss there. I would agree with this 100%. I have watched two of my kids grow up and develop through GA Soccer. After years of watching them practice it's fairly easy to pick up on which kids are better players. However, that does not necessarily translate to if the coach rates them or not. I have found very little correlation between what I see during training and who actually starts or gets the most minutes. Every coach sees things through his own lens. I think it's a waste of time to try to "figure out" what system or perspective he/she is using to determine the starters and distribution of playing time. Bottom line is that if you and your child are not happy with the situation, knowing that you've put forth 100% effort, then it's time to move on. There are too many options in Atlanta to stay in a situation that doesn't work for you.
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Post by mightydawg on Sept 28, 2018 9:53:43 GMT -5
In my experience, if you watch practice, you understand why some kids play more than others. In my experience, this is true sometimes, but many times coaches do not seem to have any good reason to like a player or dislike one. Also there are coaches who make a decision at the beginning of the season or even tryouts about a player and are very stubborn about not changing that opinion even when ALL evidence (games, training sessions, fitness, etc) point out that their initial impression was incorrect. I think your statement is vastly oversimplified and implies that coaches are actually fair and unbiased. Our experience has been hit or miss there. I tend to think that most coaches are fair minded people who are doing the best that they can. I don't think that coaches have some ulterior motive to hold players down. Typically, coaches play the players that are listening in practice, who give their best effort, are coachable, a good teammate, and are generally trying to do the best that they can at each practice. The problems that I have seen typically come in when the coach is playing the "best players" irrespective of how the kid is in practice. This give a clear indication that practice does not matter. Also, people generally have dramatically different perspectives of who is or what makes the "best player." Some people look at dribbling, others look at passing, runs off of the ball, defense, finishing, physicality, etc. The beauty is in the eye of the beholder. One thing that every coach wants is kids that are coachable, dedicated, and who give full effort.
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Post by Keeper on Sept 28, 2018 11:16:27 GMT -5
Just so we are all clear kids, like adults, and all humans are animals. Mammals to be precise. So yes calling kids animals is a correct term.
But yeah any coach that doesn’t spread playing time is only in it for wins and not development. That’s why there’s so many rules that require coaches to give 50% playing time to all players.
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Post by 4theloveofsoccer on Sept 28, 2018 14:49:59 GMT -5
Other factors to put into play is politics, team environment and club/organization philosophy. You can have parents who constantly whisper in the coaches/directors ears telling them to play their child at this position and complain about playing time, which can mess up the team dynamics on and off the field. I know all clubs have some politics involved, some more than others. If a club is more about winning and pleasing parents, I would not have my child play there.
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Post by rifle on Sept 28, 2018 16:32:28 GMT -5
Just so we are all clear kids, like adults, and all humans are animals. Mammals to be precise. So yes calling kids animals is a correct term. But yeah any coach that doesn’t spread playing time is only in it for wins and not development. That’s why there’s so many rules that require coaches to give 50% playing time to all players. Nobody would dare call a kid a plant. Right?
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Post by Keeper on Sept 28, 2018 22:21:57 GMT -5
Just so we are all clear kids, like adults, and all humans are animals. Mammals to be precise. So yes calling kids animals is a correct term. But yeah any coach that doesn’t spread playing time is only in it for wins and not development. That’s why there’s so many rules that require coaches to give 50% playing time to all players. Nobody would dare call a kid a plant. Right? Hmmm maybe a vegan...
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Post by olderthandirt on Oct 1, 2018 14:13:21 GMT -5
In my experience, this is true sometimes, but many times coaches do not seem to have any good reason to like a player or dislike one. Also there are coaches who make a decision at the beginning of the season or even tryouts about a player and are very stubborn about not changing that opinion even when ALL evidence (games, training sessions, fitness, etc) point out that their initial impression was incorrect. I think your statement is vastly oversimplified and implies that coaches are actually fair and unbiased. Our experience has been hit or miss there. I tend to think that most coaches are fair minded people who are doing the best that they can. I don't think that coaches have some ulterior motive to hold players down. Typically, coaches play the players that are listening in practice, who give their best effort, are coachable, a good teammate, and are generally trying to do the best that they can at each practice. The problems that I have seen typically come in when the coach is playing the "best players" irrespective of how the kid is in practice. This give a clear indication that practice does not matter. Also, people generally have dramatically different perspectives of who is or what makes the "best player." Some people look at dribbling, others look at passing, runs off of the ball, defense, finishing, physicality, etc. The beauty is in the eye of the beholder. One thing that every coach wants is kids that are coachable, dedicated, and who give full effort. Gotta agree with oraclesfriend here …
While we all would hope that coaches want "coachable, dedicated, (kids who) give full effort", there are many coaches out there who have different ways of picking who plays a lot and who doesn't.
One example I have seen this year is a coach of a U11 team who basically plays his 9 fastest players, regardless of their work rate, field awareness, technical skills, toughness, effort, coachability, and whatever other trait you'd like to name. This coach leaves players on the bench who can and do regularly make his starters look foolish in practice and games. His bench players get "the minimum time required" while his starters all get as much time as he can give them. And at U11, his teams win more games than they lose, so I guess that he thinks that he is "successful". I don't know why the DOC doesn't sit him down and remind him of the fact that, as an Academy coach, his job is to develop all his players, but that hasn't happened yet as far as I can tell.
I suspect that some of the players' parents may be making that clear to the club next June if things don't change, however.
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