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Post by SoccerMom on Jan 20, 2016 10:04:52 GMT -5
www.georgiasoccer.org/events/annual_general_meeting/#ruleRule w/ proposed change: 160.1 Team assignments into playing divisions and age groups by the respective committees shall be final and are not subject to appeal. There will be a maximum of 11 teams per single age group division. Rule w/ proposed change: 421.3b No player rostered on an Elite Club National League (“ECNL”) team or on an United States Development Academy (“DA”) team may play on any Classic or Athena team when that Classic or Athena team is playing in a Georgia Soccer league game (e.g. an Athena A or Classic 1, or lower, game against another Georgia Soccer Member Affiliate during the seasonal year. This rule does not prevent an ECNL or DA player from participating in a tournament; this rule only applies to league play. Any ECNL or DA player may quit her or his ECNL or DA team and thereafter join a Georgia Soccer Member Affiliate team and participate fully on that team provided she or he affirms in writing to Georgia Soccer’s satisfaction that she/he has quit and no longer is on the ECNL or DA team with which she/he was previously rostered, and (b) she/he will not be playing for that ECNL or DA team for the remainder of the Georgia Soccer seasonal year and for the remainder of the ECNL or DA seasonal year. Any violation of this rule shall result in a forfeit for the team on which the ECNL or DA player participated. Rule w/ proposed change: This will affect ECNL teams who win an RPL spot and give it to their 2nd teams-- In interpreting these rules, the following policies shall apply: a. The team is entitled to the slot; not the club. b. Any team that qualifies for a regional play slot must be able to fill the slot with a team that includes at least 9 players from the roster that earned the slot. c. Any team that qualifies for a regional play slot may receive that slot only if it is still affiliated with the Member Affiliate with which it earned that slot. Any team that is no longer affiliated with the Member Affiliate with which it earned a regional play slot or fails to remain affiliated with that Member Affiliate while competing in regional play shall immediately be disqualified from playing in regional play for 1 year, as counted from the date the team ceased being affiliated with the Member Affiliate. d. Should the same team meet more than one of the above qualification standards (i.e. 2.a. through 2.i.), then that team may fill only one slot for regional play and the next available slot for regional play will be filled by a different team that meets the next applicable qualification standard. Rationale: This new rule 755 ensures that youth soccer in Georgia is a competitive meritocracy. It allows a team to go to regional play based on its performance on the playing field against other Georgia competition and nothing more. It also prevents clubs from monopolizing regional play by passing regional slots from one team to another team. Simply put, the team that wins should be rewarded by being offered an opportunity to play in the SRPL. If it chooses not to go to the SRPL, then that open regional slot should go to the next-highest performing team, and not to some other team from the same club. In any given year and in any given age group, a team may earn the right to play against regional competition and represent Georgia in the SRPL, regardless of whether that team is from a larger club or a smaller club and regardless of whether it is from a large metro area or a smaller soccer community in Georgia. The team itself, based on its on-field success, will earn the right and privilege to play regionally, not the club at large. This rule ensures equal opportunity for all Georgia Soccer clubs (big and small) wherever in the state they are located, and it preserves the competitive meritocracy of youth soccer in this state.
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Post by stevieg on Jan 20, 2016 10:17:44 GMT -5
Here's an interesting twist: Our U14 RPL team has 8 2001s and 8 2002s. Under that new rule, we would either have to have someone play up or lose the slot.
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Post by Soccerhouse on Jan 20, 2016 10:25:22 GMT -5
Wow! Roster continuity a genius concept...
Rule w/ proposed change: 421.3b -- surprised this didn't also state they can't play in state cup
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Post by Soccerhouse on Jan 20, 2016 10:38:18 GMT -5
Interesting also that Jason Smith is running for Directory of Youth Select. Given his current involvement and role with ECNL at AFU, this doesn't seem to make a lot of sense.
I also dont' think you need to set a rule for the maximum # of teams per single age division. If a 12th team deserves to be there, they should be there. I get trying to keep the number of games down though and challenges of rescheduling.
Love the ratinale also for the ecnl/da rule -- The purpose of this proposed rule is to maintain the competitive meritocracy of Georgia Soccer and those teams competing in Georgia Soccer’s in-state league competition (as contrasted with those players and teams playing regionally or nationally). Simply put, a Georgia Soccer team should not be able to pull in players that are not part of its regular roster and who participate on a team in a higher-level of competition to inflate their league game success rate. This proposed rule is consistent with the existing Georgia Soccer rules set forth under Rule 421 regarding club-pass players and protects against the same type of skewing of the competitive meritocracy that the club-pass rule is designed to protect. Just as a player rostered on an Athena A team cannot play for an Athena B team, a player rostered on an ECNL team should not be able play for an Athena A (or lower) team; the same logic applies to DA players, too.
Not sure if this can be pulled off - another suggested rule change (given scheduling challenges etc) - I guess he's seen teams throw games...
Rule w/ proposed change: Currently several teams from a member club may play in the same division (Athena/Classic). I propose that those teams have to play their games in the first half or quarter of the schedule so they cannot manipulate games later that have a bearing on relegation/promotion within that division.
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Post by spectator on Jan 20, 2016 10:53:41 GMT -5
Wow! Roster continuity a genius concept... Rule w/ proposed change: 421.3b -- surprised this didn't also state they can't play in state cup I saw that too. Interesting little omission, huh?
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Post by SoccerMom on Jan 20, 2016 11:04:40 GMT -5
Here's an interesting twist: Our U14 RPL team has 8 2001s and 8 2002s. Under that new rule, we would either have to have someone play up or lose the slot. i don't think they have thought out the mandate yet....but Im sure it will come up in the meeting
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Post by SoccerMom on Jan 20, 2016 11:05:43 GMT -5
Wow! Roster continuity a genius concept... Rule w/ proposed change: 421.3b -- surprised this didn't also state they can't play in state cup I saw that too. Interesting little omission, huh? isn't there a rule though that a player has to play with a team a certain amount of games or be rostered with them prior to state cup in order to participate? I could be wrong....
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Post by stevieg on Jan 20, 2016 11:24:27 GMT -5
Here's an interesting twist: Our U14 RPL team has 8 2001s and 8 2002s. Under that new rule, we would either have to have someone play up or lose the slot. i don't think they have thought out the mandate yet....but Im sure it will come up in the meeting I also heard from a coach that the mandate is not a lock to be passed by GA soccer this year. Heard they may just go with u13 and under this year and leave the older kids alone until 2017 to see what shakes out with girls DA etc.
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Post by spectator on Jan 20, 2016 11:24:51 GMT -5
No idea - ECNL seems to have their own set of rules they ignore by GA Soccer
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Post by Soccerhouse on Jan 20, 2016 12:23:03 GMT -5
I saw that too. Interesting little omission, huh? isn't there a rule though that a player has to play with a team a certain amount of games or be rostered with them prior to state cup in order to participate? I could be wrong.... No, there is no rule that I'm aware of. Concorde last year brought like 75% of their ecnl team to state cup. You can bring guest players from anywhere (which also shouldn't be allowed unless they are from the same club).
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Post by Soccerhouse on Jan 20, 2016 12:24:08 GMT -5
i don't think they have thought out the mandate yet....but Im sure it will come up in the meeting I also heard from a coach that the mandate is not a lock to be passed by GA soccer this year. Heard they may just go with u13 and under this year and leave the older kids alone until 2017 to see what shakes out with girls DA etc. seems like US youth soccer with regionals/nationals would drive this decision right?
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Post by fan on Jan 20, 2016 12:45:14 GMT -5
LOL, I first read "competitive meritocracy of Georgia Soccer" as competitive mediocrity.
I wonder if 421.3b passes if the ECNL clubs will start having "ECNL Dev" teams that play each other (thus making Athena A competition more mediocre).
For 160.1, I wonder if they'll allow teams to request to move down? I know of a couple cases where teams made this request due to roster changes from one season to the next. Hopefully Georgia Soccer would be smart enough to allow that.
In the RPL rule change, I like "The team is entitled to the slot; not the club". I'm not sure I agree with the punishment if a team changes clubs but I can see how that's an attractive rule from a club's perspective.
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Post by Soccerhouse on Jan 20, 2016 13:11:02 GMT -5
Haven't heard about "ECNL Dev" teams. Is this on the horizon? Sounds like ECNL clubs goals would be to just create their own separate league system that they compete/train in.
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Post by zizou on Jan 20, 2016 14:33:51 GMT -5
Haven't heard about "ECNL Dev" teams. Is this on the horizon? Sounds like ECNL clubs goals would be to just create their own separate league system that they compete/train in. Northern California ECNL clubs do this very thing with their nonECNL teams. They have a separate league and they seem to sell it by using a similar college recruiting benefit argument. I suppose there is also some player development benefit to clubs from working things this way.
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Post by reinalocura on Jan 20, 2016 15:38:42 GMT -5
isn't there a rule though that a player has to play with a team a certain amount of games or be rostered with them prior to state cup in order to participate? I could be wrong.... No, there is no rule that I'm aware of. Concorde last year brought like 75% of their ecnl team to state cup. You can bring guest players from anywhere (which also shouldn't be allowed unless they are from the same club). I believe a player has to be on the team's official roster for state cup. Registrars all over are familiar with the last minute transfers which occur in the few weeks before state cup. Players are allowed only one transfer per season as well. I'm not sure about club passing.
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Post by Soccerhouse on Jan 20, 2016 15:58:20 GMT -5
correct, the players just need to be transferred to the teams official roster. So for the case of ECNL, those players are never even registered with GA soccer, so its as easy as adding them like a new player to the roster. There is just a max limit on roster sizes, so some other roster kids, don't make the State cup roster.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 20, 2016 16:04:52 GMT -5
Just as a player rostered on an Athena A team cannot play for an Athena B team, a player rostered on an ECNL team should not be able play for an Athena A (or lower) team; the same logic applies to DA players, too. Concorde pulling in so many ECNL players at the last State Cup was probably the last straw that finally resulted in this proposed rule change. There are legitimate needs for ECNL teams to pull up some players from Athena A but unfortunately not a good way to limit this. If the rule changes, I could see ECNL clubs pulling their second teams out of Athena eventually. I don't know if a dev league is in the works but if so, that would be too bad for RPL and Athena A especially if girls DA pulls a lot of good players away too. I disagree with the statement "a player rostered on an Athena A team cannot play for an Athena B team". The rule change a while back that allowed players to play on more than one team in a day made it more attractive for clubs to roster players on lower teams than their actual team. Granted it's limited to 3 players passes per game but it's definitely happening. A friend of my daughter's plays RPL but also plays for that club's 3rd team several divisions below. She'll still be allowed to do so if that rule changes. Interestingly, the director from that club talks of how he'd like to prevent players from playing in both Athena and ECNL but regularly rosters players down.
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Post by Soccerhouse on Jan 20, 2016 16:07:47 GMT -5
If she plays for the RPL and 3rd team, then she is actually rostered on the 3rd team vs the other way around. So that is perfectly fine.
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Post by fan on Jan 20, 2016 16:54:57 GMT -5
According to the rules, it is ok to roster an RPL player on a club's third team. What's not to love for the club? She can play for the third team or second team in addition to her real team. Just so long as ECNL clubs aren't allowed to do the same with their players .
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Post by SoccerMom on Jan 21, 2016 1:48:31 GMT -5
According to the rules, it is ok to roster an RPL player on a club's third team. What's not to love for the club? She can play for the third team or second team in addition to her real team. Just so long as ECNL clubs aren't allowed to do the same with their players . RPL rostered players are not allowed to play down except in tournaments
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Post by Deleted on Jan 21, 2016 6:51:47 GMT -5
According to the rules, it is ok to roster an RPL player on a club's third team. What's not to love for the club? She can play for the third team or second team in addition to her real team. Just so long as ECNL clubs aren't allowed to do the same with their players . RPL rostered players are not allowed to play down except in tournaments She made the RPL team but is rostered on the third team so technically she is a member of the third team. In reality, she's a member of the RPL team.
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Post by jash on Jan 21, 2016 11:08:28 GMT -5
The clubs make the rules (vote on the rules). If the clubs cared they could fairly easily prevent the cheating that is intentionally rostering a player down but playing them up. Basically if a player participates in more than X% of the higher level team's games, then that player is automatically re-rostered on that higher team and is no longer eligible for the lower team. So they could get away with it for a few games, and then the fun would be over.
But the clubs make the rules, and they want to cheat like this. And I might add, they are doing this at the expense of the players, who are at risk of overuse injuries by playing too many games, especially in one day.
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Post by guest on Jan 22, 2016 13:48:25 GMT -5
Here's the region play proposed rule 755:
2. For teams in the U14 and above age group, regional play slots for teams from Georgia will offered in the following order: a. State Cup Champion. b. State Cup Finalist (i.e. lost to the State Cup Champion in the State Cup Final game). c. First-place finisher in the top division of regional play (i.e. Premier Division). d. Second-place finisher in the top division of regional play (i.e. Premier Division). e. Third-place finisher at the State Cup (with the tie-breaker being the same tie-breaker rules for the State Cup competition, as set forth in the Georgia Soccer State Cup Tournament Rules and Regulations). f. Fourth-place finisher at the State Cup. (with the tie-breaker being the same tie-breaker rules for the State Cup competition, as set forth in the Georgia Soccer State Cup Tournament Rules and Regulations). g. First-place finisher in the second division of regional play (i.e. the First Division of SRPL) h. Second-place of the second division of regional play (i.e. the First Division of SRPL). i. The teams that finished in Classic 1/Athena A from the most recent Classic 1/Athena A season applicable to that age-group (e.g., Spring for U14 and under and Fall for U15 and above) with the first-place team receiving first right of refusal, the second-place team receiving second right of refusal, etc.
Here's my problem with this rule as currently worded. This would mean that unless you finish in the top two of either Premier Division or First Division then you are out (see sections c, d, g, h, and i). Also, other than the State Cup semi-finalists, this proposal gives no weight to State Cup finish. A team that finishes 2-0-1 is weighted no differently than a team that finishes 0-3-0. If you finish third place in the Premier Division and are the highest ranked team that did not reach the semi finals (ie 5th place) at State Cup then you are relegated. Theoretically, a team that you beat at State Cup could take your R3PL spot.
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Post by kellymama on Jan 23, 2016 15:44:24 GMT -5
Any updates from today's meeting?
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Post by fan on Jan 23, 2016 16:08:53 GMT -5
The meeting was moved to Feb 13 due to weather.
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Post by infoguy on Jan 26, 2016 7:49:05 GMT -5
Here's the region play proposed rule 755:
2. For teams in the U14 and above age group, regional play slots for teams from Georgia will offered in the following order: a. State Cup Champion. b. State Cup Finalist (i.e. lost to the State Cup Champion in the State Cup Final game). c. First-place finisher in the top division of regional play (i.e. Premier Division). d. Second-place finisher in the top division of regional play (i.e. Premier Division). e. Third-place finisher at the State Cup (with the tie-breaker being the same tie-breaker rules for the State Cup competition, as set forth in the Georgia Soccer State Cup Tournament Rules and Regulations). f. Fourth-place finisher at the State Cup. (with the tie-breaker being the same tie-breaker rules for the State Cup competition, as set forth in the Georgia Soccer State Cup Tournament Rules and Regulations). g. First-place finisher in the second division of regional play (i.e. the First Division of SRPL) h. Second-place of the second division of regional play (i.e. the First Division of SRPL). i. The teams that finished in Classic 1/Athena A from the most recent Classic 1/Athena A season applicable to that age-group (e.g., Spring for U14 and under and Fall for U15 and above) with the first-place team receiving first right of refusal, the second-place team receiving second right of refusal, etc.
Here's my problem with this rule as currently worded. This would mean that unless you finish in the top two of either Premier Division or First Division then you are out (see sections c, d, g, h, and i). Also, other than the State Cup semi-finalists, this proposal gives no weight to State Cup finish. A team that finishes 2-0-1 is weighted no differently than a team that finishes 0-3-0. If you finish third place in the Premier Division and are the highest ranked team that did not reach the semi finals (ie 5th place) at State Cup then you are relegated. Theoretically, a team that you beat at State Cup could take your R3PL spot.
What exactly is "Regional Play" - is this in reference to who will play regular season RPL - Premier and Division One? If so, it doesn't reflect what I've seen on the GA Soccer site, under usys-assets.ae-admin.com/assets/926/15/2016%20Fall%20SRPL%20EAST%20Divisions%20rev.%2012.7.pdf
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Post by guest on Jan 26, 2016 11:53:02 GMT -5
Yes, in this context regional play = RPL. This is a proposed change to the current team selection method that you find on the GA website. One that I feel was not well thought out. Plus I like the comment at the end where Ga Soccer reviewed the proposed change and finds no issues with it. Some review!
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Post by infoguy on Jan 28, 2016 7:16:08 GMT -5
Interesting potential rule change. Not only did the link above lay it all out in terms of the RPL divisions converting to the new age mandate, they started populating the 2016 Fall SRPL East Boys tables with "pre-qualified" teams.
Where did you find the proposed rule change?
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Post by SoccerMom on Jan 28, 2016 8:42:53 GMT -5
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Post by guest on Jan 28, 2016 13:25:59 GMT -5
Interesting potential rule change. Not only did the link above lay it all out in terms of the RPL divisions converting to the new age mandate, they started populating the 2016 Fall SRPL East Boys tables with "pre-qualified" teams. Where did you find the proposed rule change? HA! Look at the proposed rule now. It has a big WITHDRAWN superimposed over it. I had no idea that the executive director of Inter Atlanta was such an avid reader of this forum!!
usys-assets.ae-admin.com/assets/970/15/Proposals%20for%20Rule%20Changes%2016%20AGM1.PDF
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