FdB out

Wasn't a good fit.. better to cut now than lose another year. Now lets find someone really kick ass!

The one good thing I did like about FdB was that he was not allergic to the Academy Players. It is my hope that the next coach builds on that pathway from the Academy to USL to First Team in lieu of going shopping in South America only...

I do not like the ATL UTD win now method. That method will not help academy players to make the first team.  As I said earlier, we should give ATL UTD credit for upping the quality of play in the league with its early success.  Now though the league is harder and deeper than it was 3 years ago...  I will keep watching, but the quality of players is not there right now...  I hope I am wrong because I want to see them win.

Now that is an idea and a very good one.  More importantly, that would be a very good brand of footy to watch 🤞🤞🤞

I don't think Frank was the issue, the fact that they would not keep good players is the issue. I know Nagbe left because he wanted to, Parkhurst retired and Miguel obviously got a better opportunity over in Europe.

The players that have left because of contract negotiation should have been treated a lot better considering they are the top team in Atlanta next to the Dream.

As usual, The Athletic does a good job of incorporating information from multiple sources to paint us a good picture of what was brewing under the surface. Didn't realize that both Martinez players at one time or another walked off the pitch.  That would never have been allowed by Tata.  I know it's behind a paywall, so I have tried to copy and paste the article in its entirety...

theathletic.com/1950530/2020/07/24/inside-atlanta-uniteds-failed-evolution-under-frank-de-boer/

Raw Article
Inside Atlanta United’s failed ‘evolution’ under Frank de Boer - By Felipe Cardenas and Paul Tenorio Jul 24, 2020 81

Inside the Mercedes Benz Stadium locker room last May, a few hours before their game against Toronto FC, Atlanta United players watched the second leg of the UEFA Champions League semifinal between Ajax and Tottenham Hotspur.
When Brazilian winger Lucas Moura’s stoppage-time winner trickled past Ajax goalkeeper Andre Onana, knocking out the Dutch on aggregate score, a large chunk of Atlanta’s locker room erupted in cheers. Outside the room, within earshot of the celebrations, sat the person for whom the cheers were targeted: Atlanta coach Frank de Boer, a former Ajax great.

De Boer’s tenure with Atlanta United ended on Friday after both club and coach “mutually agreed to part ways,” according to a statement from the organization. The Dutch manager’s exit ended a tumultuous stint that seemed doomed the moment Atlanta’s front office decided to drastically change the locker room’s culture. It was meant to be an evolution of their successful two-year run under Gerardo “Tata” Martino, but what initially transpired felt more like an overhaul. For some in and around the organization, that Champions League celebration last May illustrated the relationship between coach and team — one that got off to a poor start and never truly recovered. In the end, De Boer lasted just 19 months in Atlanta.

De Boer was a big-name hire. A Dutch national team legend who managed boyhood club Ajax to four Eredivisie titles. The allure of bringing Johan Cruyff-inspired footballing philosophies to Major League Soccer was interesting in theory, but Atlanta United was built largely around a South American culture, from designated players Miguel Almiron, Pity Martínez, Ezequiel Barco and Josef Martinez to coach Tata Martino. It defined the team’s identity on and off the field.

De Boer arrived with promises that there would not be a major shake-up to the style and culture of the team.  “This is about evolution, not revolution,” Atlanta United president Darren Eales said at the time of the hire. That quickly proved not to be the case, multiple sources said. The team spent every day for several weeks in preseason working on defensive shape. It immediately alienated some of the biggest stars on the team. While one source who was present during the coaching transition said some players never gave De Boer a chance, that came with a caveat: “He didn’t help himself, either.”

De Boer’s coaching style also felt starkly different from Martino’s detail-oriented approach. The changes he implemented didn’t come with much direction.   “He was clearly lacking detail in what he was doing,” another source present for the training sessions said.
Those issues were prevalent on the inside. Multiple sources said star forward Josef Martinez walked off the training field in frustration on more than one occasion, for example. The tension also spilled out in the media. Former Atlanta center back Leandro González Pírez criticized United’s conservative style under De Boer. While tactics were perceived to be the divide between De Boer and the locker room, the lack of ambition from the coach was what truly unsettled the players.

“Things have changed a lot, the way the club has played the game, and we don’t like it,” said González Pírez during last year’s MLS All-Star Game in Orlando.  For a while, at least, it looked like the club could successfully navigate the tension between the team’s star players and its coach. De Boer tweaked his system to allow more freedom to the attacking players and Atlanta started to roll. It won the inaugural Campeones Cup with an impressive performance against Liga MX’s Club América, and captured the U.S. Open Cup. But United’s MLS Cup title defense was halted by Toronto FC in the conference final.

The relationship deteriorated even more in 2020, and it wasn’t helped by the significant roster transformation during the offseason. Atlanta traded Darlington Nagbe to the Columbus Crew, sold Tito Villalba and González Pírez, and traded Julian Gressel to D.C. United. Their replacements have underwhelmed. De Boer was going to have to form the club in his image with a less-talented roster, and the top players that remained were some of the highly paid South American players with whom he clashed most. Josef Martinez’s ACL injury only made things significantly more difficult.

If De Boer had changed in late 2019 by playing a more attack-oriented style, he reverted to the possession-based system he preferred in 2020, once again clashing with the talents of the club’s stars. But bigger problems were starting to bubble up. Multiple sources said De Boer’s top assistants were not present for many of the individual training sessions when Atlanta players first started to return to the team’s training facility. (De Boer himself was absent for some of the sessions because he had to return to Holland due to a family emergency.)

Another training ground walk-off just before the club left for Orlando — this time from star Pity Martínez, according to multiple sources — signaled that the problems were not going away. Atlanta United’s winless run at the MLS is Back Tournament only made it seem that the tensions were starting to impact the team’s performance. Lacking energy throughout their three group-stage matches, Atlanta failed to score a single goal in any of them.

When ESPN cameras captured technical director Carlos Bocanegra speaking with veteran Jeff Larentowicz on the bench during the game against Columbus, those with knowledge of the club’s dynamics felt it was a sign that change was coming. Bocanegra typically steered clear of the locker room, meeting rooms and the team — especially on game days.


Three days later, De Boer was out.

Hard lessons were learned for a club that has proven to be among the most ambitious in the league, and a fan base that had become accustomed to success. De Boer is Atlanta United’s first public failure, and some believe it could’ve been avoided had the front office made a hire that was more suited for Atlanta’s established culture.

Where does the club go from here? A thorough examination of Atlanta’s direction must take place, including tactical philosophies, roster decisions and adjusted expectations in the COVID-19 era. Furthermore, Atlanta United cannot afford to make a similar type of decision with their next head coach.

Former New York City FC manager Domènec Torrent is currently available. Torrent’s link to the Pep Guardiola coaching philosophy makes him an attractive candidate, as does his MLS experience. Torrent’s time at NYCFC included a 4-1 dismantling of Atlanta United last September. Torrent implemented an attacking style in New York that featured aggressive wing play and creative freedom for players like Maxi Moralez and Alexandru Mitrita.

There are eight South Americans on Atlanta United’s current roster, so the top coaching candidates in that region are also worth exploring.

River Plate’s Marcelo Gallardo was heavily linked with Inter Miami before the expansion ultimately hired Diego Alonso. Gallardo is recognized as one of the world’s top managers at the moment, and he’s likely to finish his contract with River, which ends in 2021. Amid interest from Brazilian power Flamengo, Gallardo’s agent, Juan Berros, said recently, “He’s with River and he’s not negotiating with any other team.”

Another Argentine manager with a high-tempo, aggressive style is Gabriel Heinze, who is also currently unemployed. Heinze left Velez Sarsfield in March on his own volition and has been linked to coaching opportunities in Europe. Heinze is a fiery competitor, and at Velez, he left a lasting tactical stamp on the legendary institution. Heinze was most recently linked to Olympique de Marseille in Ligue 1 and Espanyol, who were just relegated from La Liga.

Finally, Club América’s Miguel Herrera would be an absolute mega-signing for Atlanta United. However, El Piojo recently signed a four-year contract extension with América — one that pays him seven figures annually, meaning that hiring him likely isn’t financially viable at the moment. Herrera has acknowledged that he has received interest from MLS clubs in the past.   “(MLS) is a growing league, it is very solid, very strong and a great opportunity, but if I am going to leave I believe that it would be to Europe,” Herrera told ESPN’s Radio Formula in June. “If not, I’ll stay at América.”

The ongoing coronavirus pandemic makes it difficult to determine a timetable for Atlanta to hire their third coach in club history. One thing is certain: Atlanta United is in crisis mode. How the club manages it will decide both the short- and long-term future of the organization.

Probably would have been canned last year, but winning those trophies made it almost impossible to remove him.
3 coaches in 4 seasons, next coach still has some issues for sure without a proven goal scorer out there. what is the current goalless scoring streak at now?
and that is a management problem - Yes, you can't just replace Martinez with a single player, but goals should still come.
removing fan favorite players like LGP, Gressel and Villalba and their replacements so far don't seem to be up to par.

bottom line Pity and Barco have to take over and play to the level everyone expects them to play at consistently and both need to stay on their feet and off the ground.
Lennon is an average player at best and Hyndman has a knack to disappear for a vast majority of games -- This roster currently just seems very disjointed.

How was Bello in the game?
I've only watched highlights and the goal AU conceded was a pathetic team effort defensively.

From the article "The changes he implemented didn’t come with much direction. “He was clearly lacking detail in what he was doing,” another source present for the training sessions said." From the highest to the lower of levels. People have no idea how common this problem is, and contributes to the disconnect between players and coaches in addition to everyone understanding why something that sounds good and looks good on paper does not translate on the training ground, let alone the playing field. 

I've enjoyed watching him so far. When he has the opportunity to build that connection with Josef... I think it'll be very productive.

Gressel is a far superior player than Lennon
Lennon would struggle to start for most USL teams.
He is part of the overall issue of horrific talent identification

(Rifle) “...Midfielders have to be able to run like deer all day long and he was regularly gassed by minute 55...”

I’d be gassed by minute 5, and then I’’d fall down like Barco.

No. No I can’t (head down in shame).

Article in The Athletic(behind paywall, see full article below) Sorry for the length...

Exclusive: Frank de Boer on his Atlanta United departure and what’s next By Felipe Cardenas Aug 20, 2020

Four weeks after parting ways with Atlanta United, Frank de Boer is back in his native Holland settling into life away from football. Speaking exclusively to The Athletic from his home near Amsterdam, De Boer remained forthright and transparent as he reflected on his 19 months in Major League Soccer. De Boer spoke about the culture clash he walked into at Atlanta United in 2019 and what he plans to do next. He didn’t expect to be reevaluating his future after less than two seasons in Atlanta, but when the 2018 MLS Cup champions were sent home reeling after their winless performance at the MLS is Back Tournament in Orlando, the Dutch manager’s future was in serious doubt.

De Boer remained committed to the project and planned on going straight back to work after leaving the bubble. But early on Friday, July 24th — three days after Atlanta United’s third consecutive group stage loss — he was at his Midtown apartment across from Atlanta’s famed Fox Theatre when he received a text from Atlanta United technical director Carlos Bocanegra, asking to meet at the club’s training ground. De Boer arrived at the club’s facility expecting to go through the now customary coronavirus protocols in preparation for a Monday morning training session. Instead he was met by Bocanegra and club president Darren Eales in a second-floor office. “I had no clue,” said De Boer when asked if he had expected to be let go. “Carlos didn’t say that much. It was only Darren that was talking. Those things normally go very quickly. I can be very angry, but they had already made a decision.” Atlanta United’s statement said that the club and De Boer had “mutually agreed to part ways.” The Dutchman didn’t refute that but, from his point of view, it seemed he had little choice in the matter. Nonetheless, De Boer understood — albeit reluctantly — that a change in direction was best for Atlanta United.

In spite of a locker room dynamic that had eroded under his management, De Boer felt that he had not yet lost the group. He acknowledged that he wasn’t getting the best out of the team at the time, with which Eales and Bocanegra agreed. “Then you come to a solution,” De Boer said. A week later, De Boer was back in the Netherlands. He felt it was best to immediately leave Atlanta following his abrupt dismissal to avoid any chance encounters with fans on the street. “You don’t really have the energy to explain it,” De Boer said. “Normally you want to get out of that environment.”  De Boer’s MLS story could have been much different had Atlanta United defeated Toronto FC in last season’s Eastern Conference final. Atlanta played well that night, which makes the sting of that loss more difficult to forget. Had they advanced, they would’ve hosted MLS Cup for a second consecutive year, with an opportunity to establish a new MLS dynasty. De Boer still thinks about that loss, almost in disbelief, while contemplating what should’ve been a spectacular achievement for the club. “We could have won three titles in one year,” said De Boer over the high-pitched bark of the family dog. “You think, ‘how did we lose that game?’ We were so dominant.”

If results were the only measurable metric, the 2020 season started well for Atlanta United. Atlanta fought tooth and nail to beat FC Motagua in the CONCACAF Champions League, and in tight victories over Cincinnati and Nashville. Atlanta was then outclassed by Club América before COVID-19 suspended soccer around the world. Meanwhile, the problems inside the Atlanta United locker room began to manifest themselves even before the pandemic. When asked about some of his players’ pointedly exuberant celebrations when Ajax — the club where De Boer experienced tremendous success as both a player and manager — was knocked out of the Champions League last season, De Boer didn’t seem surprised that they wanted Tottenham to win.  “Most of the players were for the English team,” he said. “That’s a little bit of the culture. Normally in North America they are for English teams. I don’t know if they were happy.”

De Boer was not aware that ESPN’s cameras had captured Bocanegra talking to midfielder Jeff Larentowicz on Atlanta United’s bench during their 1-0 loss to Columbus in Orlando. He said that Bocanegra and Eales were always seated behind the reserves, but not on the bench. De Boer confirmed The Athletic’s reporting that Josef Martínez and Pity Martínez had abandoned training sessions in frustration during the 2019 season. He said that it was difficult, but added that similar situations occurred under Gerardo Martino.

“Tata had the same problem,” De Boer said. “It’s already there and it’s difficult when you have a new coach.” De Boer referred to Josef Martínez as one of the best strikers he has ever worked with, and touched on the player’s temper as a reason why he would walk off a practice pitch. “(Josef) gets frustrated because his quality is much higher than a lot of other players,” De Boer said. “But he has to understand that it’s not always about you because you can give a bad example. I worked very fine with him and sometimes you have disagreements, but for me he was a great person and a great player.” De Boer’s dicey relationship with Pity Martínez was also well-documented, but the pair managed to find some common ground. When asked to pinpoint why their relationship was often rocky, De Boer believes that the lofty expectations that were placed on Martínez and the change in culture contributed to the player’s difficult adjustment period. “Last season I had some trouble sometimes with a decision with Pity, but I think he started really well this season,” said De Boer. “If he plays really well, of course he’ll play every game, but he didn’t play well and everybody could see that. I accept, because that’s normal with every player who comes from a new culture.”

During a Zoom call with reporters on Thursday, Martínez said that he didn’t believe that his relationship with De Boer was complex. For Martínez it came down to a difference of opinion. He said that he respected De Boer as a manager, adding that De Boer’s tactics didn’t align with Atlanta United’s style of play. “We always gave everything for him and his staff,” Martínez said. “These are decisions that the players don’t make. The club made the decision. It’s never good when a coach leaves.” Martínez started this season in top form. Over the two legs against Motagua, the former River Plate star tallied an assist and two goals, followed by an assist in the regular-season win against Cincinnati. De Boer said that the 27-year-old Argentine had become a third captain behind Brad Guzan and Larentowicz, but shortly before leaving for Orlando, Martínez refused to go.

“Suddenly he didn’t want to go to the bubble out of nothing,” said De Boer. “Then he had a conversation with (Bocanegra) and it was OK. I didn’t have a problem with him. He’s a really fine player. Sometimes you don’t understand what’s behind them — what’s the reason that suddenly one week he’s like this, and then afterwards he’s totally how I want him to be.” De Boer conceded that a European manager stepping into the firmly established South American culture at Atlanta United would face immediate challenges, and he certainly did. Yet the fallout from that drastic change in philosophy cannot be pinned squarely on the manager. Even so, De Boer was confident that he would be able to connect with Atlanta United’s core group of Latin American players, who were instrumental in accelerating the club’s success.

“I inherited from Tata, and there was the Argentina culture, you know, Argentine music in the locker room and all of that,” said De Boer. “(The front office) wanted a European coach. They wanted a little bit more of the North American culture or something like that, but it’s almost impossible when you have so many players that stick together, and that’s normal. I did it at Barcelona with the Dutch guys. It’s difficult to break that culture.”  And more so when that culture had been cemented by Atlanta United’s most important players. Josef Martínez and Leandro González Pírez were vocal and spiritual leaders inside Atlanta’s locker room. Pity Martínez joined the group last season after being named the South America player of the year. Before his transfer to Newcastle United, Miguel Almirón led through his dynamic play and commitment on both ends of the field. Atlanta United continues to scout in Latin America, evidenced by the recent signings of Jurgen Damm and Erick Torres from Mexico. The player profile that Atlanta has targeted even after De Boer’s stint ended remains ingrained in the club’s identity.

“(The South Americans) were the best players on the team and the American (player) has to accept that,” De Boer continued. “That’s sometimes difficult, especially when I’m not coming from that culture. They had the feeling of success so why change things? That’s always difficult.”  During a call with reporters on Monday, Guzan spoke about how interim manager Stephen Glass has opened the lines of communication between his staff and the players. After just a few weeks of training under Glass, Guzan believes that the team has a better understanding of how to collectively go in “a positive direction.” When asked if that type of communication strategy was part of the daily dynamic under De Boer, Guzan said “it wasn’t happening to the extent that it’s happening now.” De Boer’s description of the relationship he had with his players offers a revealing look at his style of management and the expectations he placed on the group.  He preferred to keep the players at an arm’s length because, as he put it, giving them too much information would lead to overthinking concepts and tactics on matchday. He wasn’t surprised, however, that Atlanta United’s captain felt that communication should’ve been better.

“Maybe I was already thinking further than them, and maybe I expected them to understand it,” De Boer said. “You never know, of course. If they say that, probably there will be some truth in that. I had the feeling that sometimes (the players) wanted more information.” De Boer did listen to his players, though. That was evident in the summer of 2019 when he tweaked his conservative tactics, and Atlanta United found success and the goals that they desperately desired. De Boer also adjusted his training sessions when he realized that the players were not invested in his high-energy passing drills. Intricate passing exercises were an essential part of his system, but when the players weren’t responding to them, he dialed them back and asked an assistant to integrate those types of drills into the pre-training warm-up.

“That’s the Dutch culture,” said De Boer. “I saw it in Italy and also here. They’re not interested in those kinds of things, but they want to play really nice football.” De Boer’s tactical decisions in Atlanta — namely the 3-4-3 system that he was steadfast in implementing — were often hit or miss. He confronted similar issues at Inter Milan and Crystal Palace when he attempted to install a highly fluid and technically demanding system that, when executed well, can overwhelm opponents. De Boer remains adamant about his decision to stick with a formation that can backfire without the right personnel or a collaborative understanding from the players. He said that Atlanta United had the players to fit his system, despite in his estimation, the club not having any wingers.

“I really think still that it’s the best system for all,” he said. “Offensively I’ve always given a lot of freedom, and defensively I want them to do what I think is the best and I think (Atlanta United) can do much better (defensively). I think that’s going to be a challenge for every coach in Atlanta. If you see, for example Inter Milan, and how they defend with the same system, you see all the big players are doing their jobs. (Romelu) Lukaku and Lautaro (Martínez) dropping back and defending. That’s a team effort. “(Atlanta) is not Inter Milan. We have a different philosophy. We want to press really high and everywhere be one-versus-one. That was always a hard battle for me. We want to press really high, but sometimes you cannot do that. Sometimes you have to be very compact and play a little bit like Inter and then you’ll see, you get a lot of chances.”  Atlanta United is a club where style points are expected, and that is where the marriage between Atlanta and De Boer struggled the most. Meeting that expectation became considerably more difficult for De Boer after his roster was overhauled before this season, and after Josef Martínez was lost to a season-ending knee injury. Defender Michael Parkhurst’s retirement was another significant blow according to De Boer. The 50-year-old manager said that he was fine with some of the roster decisions that were made during the winter, but one that he didn’t agree with was the trade that sent midfielder Darlington Nagbe to the Columbus Crew.

“One hundred percent not,” De Boer said emphatically. “You cannot replace a player like that. I wanted to keep him because to me he is the best midfielder. He’s one of the best players and he was so important for the team, especially because of the way we played. Julian Gressel was a surprise to me that suddenly he has to move because with Josef, (Gressel) was involved in maybe 60 percent of the goals for Atlanta United, so for me that was also a very big surprise.” De Boer is in no hurry to get back to coaching, but he said that he’s not one to sit on his couch and do nothing. Becoming a TV pundit in Europe is one option, but for now he’ll occupy his time with golf and CrossFit training. De Boer, who played four and a half seasons with Barcelona, winning La Liga in 1999, seemed open to the possibility of joining Ronald Koeman’s staff at Barcelona, adding that his heart remains blaugrana. “I have to think about that,” De Boer said. “It’s an option for me, but if it’s not an option, it’s not an option.”  Multiple reports say that Koeman will appoint former Hoffenheim manager Alfred Schreuder as his assistant in the Catalan capital. Despite the sour ending, De Boer enjoyed his time in the States and said that he’d be open to another MLS opportunity. He noted the league’s salary cap restrictions and having to sign USL players to MLS contracts before their first-team debuts as factors that are holding MLS back. “You know the salary cap, that’s why the difference of the quality in teams is so big and that’s why every team can win,” De Boer said. “Sometimes you want to get to a higher level and that stops you. But at the end, I have more pluses than negatives.”

After coaching in a young league like MLS, someone recognizable like De Boer will probably have options in other emerging football markets like China or the Middle East. Spending time with his family is his priority for the time being, but he said one can never say never. “Suddenly they come in with a really big bag (of money), then it’s sometimes difficult to say no,” said De Boer with a laugh. “I have to wait. I’m happy here. We will see what’s coming up.”

Yep.  The original story on Nagbe was that he wanted to get back to his Ohio roots and also play for the Columbus manager, who had coached him at both Portland and in college at Akron.  But recently I've read that it really was just about money and that we either couldn't/wouldn't pay him what he was looking for, so he asked to be traded.

Gressel was definitely a money issue - he wanted more than what we could (or were willing to) offer, so we traded him.