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Post by rifle on Nov 3, 2021 20:13:02 GMT -5
It’s just a way to collect money. Club soccer has been going that direction since promotion and relegation were relegated in favor of competing leagues- all claiming to be superior but never having to prove it on the field. Cha Ching. All because some parents couldn’t handle the notion that their kid might not be good enough for the first (or second or third or fourth team) and they are convinced that rec soccer sucks. But I’ve got news for you. It doesn’t.. and they aren’t.
As for mouthy parents.. good luck. There are b-holes in every gathering of humans. More when they feel entitled to something the “pay for”.
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Post by papacoach on Nov 3, 2021 20:30:57 GMT -5
What? Parents/families pay into the system but yet, they have to be silent.. Who’s holding the coaches, clubs and leagues accountable for their actions? I have seen many of coaches be issued red cards and over the top sideline behavior, I have seen and heard a fair share of parents being unfiltered during games among the mass of golf clapping parents.
IF only there was a way to issue fines and suspend coaches/club w/o pay
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Post by notcrazysoccerdad on Nov 4, 2021 8:02:22 GMT -5
Who holds parents accountable?
Why not other parents? If someone is being an a-hole on the sidelines we need to tell them to be quiet. We should be able to self-police.
As for being jerks to coaches, that's what club admin (should be) for.
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Post by soccerfan30 on Nov 4, 2021 8:49:59 GMT -5
Unfortunately we live in a society where "it isn't our business" or people look the other way. If you expect parents to hold each other accountable that may be a big ask, most people will choose not to interfere.
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Post by mistergrinch on Nov 4, 2021 9:52:33 GMT -5
What la-la land do you live in, grasshopper? I know of kids who've been kicked out of clubs because of parents... I know of VERY good players who clubs won't touch because of parents. Clubs absolutely will get rid of parents if they're bad enough - you just aren't describing behavior that reaches that level. Mostly you're just shrieking because you hold a minority opinion about a coach and it didn't go your way. Your constant whining about 'defaming' a coach is already old. Defamation would indicate that people are saying things that aren't true - the fact that he was removed from his position says otherwise. As others pointed out - if it was one parent, the club would tell them to pound sand... when it's a majority of the team chiming in - the coach gets sent packing. Frankly - the crap he pulled at tryouts should have been a dis-qualifier (one of my kids knows the players who were affected).. telling kids who are seniors and being recruited that they have a spot on a GA team.. then AFTER tryouts - just leaving them hanging without a spot and too late to look elsewhere? You're screwing with these kids lives. That is indefensible.
Please explain to me how that's holding them accountable? Developing them? Making them 'elite'?
[edit]
Just searched grasshopper's post history - they've been involved in virtually zero discussion on this board that DIDN'T involve MC.. all the way back to the Concorde->TH move.
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Post by Soccerhouse on Nov 4, 2021 10:04:50 GMT -5
Honestly -- i've tried to hold parents accountable, but many can't see past the selfish attitude that their kids are the only ones that matter.
I don't have the patience for it anymore particularly when parents begin to get argumentative on the sidelines or at a training session.
Especially as the kids get to be U15+, let the kids handle their own battles -- the kids should be talking to the coaches, the kids should be communicating with the coaches.
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Post by oldhat on Nov 4, 2021 10:08:28 GMT -5
Lately, I've seen a lot of defamation going on in this blog so I pose the question - who hold soccer parents accountable? If the coach holds the parents accountable - then shortly after there is a thread that pops up on this forum defaming the coach. Youth soccer clubs don't want to release parents acting crazy because they don't want the parent to bash the club or Director so instead they allow the parents to bash the coach. So, who holds the parents accountable? Is Youth Soccer just a toxic environment where parents get to say and do what they want because they pay top dollar to play? Is youth soccer even about the sport anymore or just a way to collect money? Are there any standards left in youth soccer or is the accepted mentality that everyone is a winner no matter whether they try or not? Clubs tell parents all the time not to come back. I have seen parents forbidden from attending practices or games if the player was going to be allowed to stay. Several families have been told to look elsewhere before and during try-outs. I am going to ask you a couple of questions. When are parents supposed to come forward about problems? If the coach refuses to have a sit down with the family is it appropriate for them to go to the DOC? To you, what is inappropriate behavior for a coach? When does a coach cross the line in the treatment of a player? How are DOC's supposed to know when a coach is being inappropriate when DOC's are not at all practices and games? |
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Post by oldhat on Nov 4, 2021 10:11:20 GMT -5
Honestly -- i've tried to hold parents accountable, but many can't see past the selfish attitude that their kids are the only ones that matter. I don't have the patience for it anymore particularly when parents begin to get argumentative on the sidelines or at a training session. Especially as the kids get to be U15+, let the kids handle their own battles -- the kids should be talking to the coaches, the kids should be communicating with the coaches. I agree in general.....but what about players U14-? Should they be able to communicate with a coach? Yes. Expecting them to advocate for themselves when they are being mistreated....not so much. |
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Post by slickdaddy96 on Nov 4, 2021 10:29:10 GMT -5
Honestly -- i've tried to hold parents accountable, but many can't see past the selfish attitude that their kids are the only ones that matter. I don't have the patience for it anymore particularly when parents begin to get argumentative on the sidelines or at a training session. Especially as the kids get to be U15+, let the kids handle their own battles -- the kids should be talking to the coaches, the kids should be communicating with the coaches. I agree in general.....but what about players U14-? Should they be able to communicate with a coach? Yes. Expecting them to advocate for themselves when they are being mistreated....not so much. Most U15+ kids that don't like their coach won't be playing for that coach for long. They will seek greener pastures rather than having a conversation with an adult who in their eyes is not being fair to them. I don't get involved in my kid's playing time and other issues once they get U13+. If they don't want to handle it then they either get better so they get playing time or they find another team. I'm not going to fight my kid's battles with stuff like that unless there is some kind of gross negligence or inappropriate issues going on. They need to learn how to do that on their own. It will help them later in life. |
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Post by tross2443 on Nov 4, 2021 11:36:27 GMT -5
I rarely post on this, but this topic was very intersting to me. It is very hard to hold a parent accountable in a climate where each child is worth roughly 1500 dollars. The moment you charge a service, the parent becomes a customer. And just like most places that customer holds a lot of power. Clubs ultimately want to fill as many teams as possible, in order to fund the programs in which they offer. So as a coach, director, or staff of a club, you have to bend to the parents/customers to ensure repeat business. However, if a club truly has a problem with parents, you do have options. Refund the parent, and release the player (or don't choose the kid the following season). But we all know this also won't happen (for the most part).
The same can be said for the club/coach as well. If you are with a top coach, club (or team), and you don't like the treatement, culture, playing time, or even simply fit for your child, most parents won't speak on the situation or leave the program. People tend to value success and wins over happiness. So you will always see posts from peopel who knew they were getting into a circumstance they might not enjoy, but chose to enter into that scenerio regardless. Unfortunately, they use the forum as a place to air out their greavences. Personlly, I think it's a good source of therapy for those individuals. Better here than seeing it spill onto the soccer pitch.
By the way, if you know me in real life, i'm sure my username gives me away. lol
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Post by SoccerFirst on Nov 4, 2021 11:51:24 GMT -5
Oldhat Q & A
Q: When are parents supposed to come forward about problems? In an ideal world, as soon as you, the child's parent and the paying customer feel compelled to. However, don't say I didn't warn you, because in the real world there will most likely be retribution for the complaint.
Q. If the coach refuses to have a sit down with the family is it appropriate for them to go to the DOC? If a paid professional coach refuses to meet privately, assuming the parent isn't waiting by coach's car and requested the meeting according to coach/club policy, then the parent should reach out to DOC.
Q. What is inappropriate behavior for a coach? A. Well this is a loaded question. I have seen a lot. I think that they should be held to their club's code of conduct, ECNL has a Coach's Code of Conduct and US Youth Soccer as well. Lastly, IF you suspect verbal abuse including insulting, intimidating, threatening, shaming, demeaning, or derogatory language, among other forms of communication, it's your duty as a parent to report it. Perpetrators of verbal abuse often misuse their authority and prey on those in a subordinate position. Victims of verbal abuse are often told they are to blame for the abuser's behavior and reluctant to take action to end the abuse. Verbal abuse may lead to stress, depression, physical ailments, and other damage.(US Legal.com) THIS is why if a parent suspects verbal abuse, the U14 CHILD does not need to address the coach, or alleged abuser.
Q. When does a coach cross the line in the treatment of a player? A. When your kid gets in the car after practice in tears, or when you tell them its time to get ready for practice/game and your player tells you they don't want to go. Parents know their kids best, you don't want to see your child suffer in silence to the point where they want to quit. Don't allow one lousy coach to steal your child's love of the game. If your child ALL OF A SUDDEN doesn't love soccer, and they have since they were 4, something has changed and a conversation needs to be had to figure out what's going on.
Q. How are DOC's supposed to know when a coach is being inappropriate when DOC's are not at all practices and games? A. It needs to be reported to the DOC and then if nothing is done, whoever writes the DOC's six figure check should be contacted for a meeting.
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Post by oldhat on Nov 4, 2021 12:21:45 GMT -5
Oldhat Q & A Q: When are parents supposed to come forward about problems? In an ideal world, as soon as you, the child's parent and the paying customer feel compelled to. However, don't say I didn't warn you, because in the real world there will most likely be retribution for the complaint. Q. If the coach refuses to have a sit down with the family is it appropriate for them to go to the DOC? If a paid professional coach refuses to meet privately, assuming the parent isn't waiting by coach's car and requested the meeting according to coach/club policy, then the parent should reach out to DOC. Q. What is inappropriate behavior for a coach? A. Well this is a loaded question. I have seen a lot. I think that they should be held to their club's code of conduct, ECNL has a Coach's Code of Conduct and US Youth Soccer as well. Lastly, IF you suspect verbal abuse including insulting, intimidating, threatening, shaming, demeaning, or derogatory language, among other forms of communication, it's your duty as a parent to report it. Perpetrators of verbal abuse often misuse their authority and prey on those in a subordinate position. Victims of verbal abuse are often told they are to blame for the abuser's behavior and reluctant to take action to end the abuse. Verbal abuse may lead to stress, depression, physical ailments, and other damage.(US Legal.com) THIS is why if a parent suspects verbal abuse, the U14 CHILD does not need to address the coach, or alleged abuser. Q. When does a coach cross the line in the treatment of a player? A. When your kid gets in the car after practice in tears, or when you tell them its time to get ready for practice/game and your player tells you they don't want to go. Parents know their kids best, you don't want to see your child suffer in silence to the point where they want to quit. Don't allow one lousy coach to steal your child's love of the game. If your child ALL OF A SUDDEN doesn't love soccer, and they have since they were 4, something has changed and a conversation needs to be had to figure out what's going on. Q. How are DOC's supposed to know when a coach is being inappropriate when DOC's are not at all practices and games? A. It needs to be reported to the DOC and then if nothing is done, whoever writes the DOC's six figure check should be contacted for a meeting. Great Answer! I was wondering what the OP thought. Can parents ever be in the right to them? |
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Post by DunwoodySoccerDad on Nov 4, 2021 12:34:25 GMT -5
I rarely post on this, but this topic was very intersting to me. It is very hard to hold a parent accountable in a climate where each child is worth roughly 1500 dollars. The moment you charge a service, the parent becomes a customer. And just like most places that customer holds a lot of power. Clubs ultimately want to fill as many teams as possible, in order to fund the programs in which they offer. So as a coach, director, or staff of a club, you have to bend to the parents/customers to ensure repeat business. However, if a club truly has a problem with parents, you do have options. Refund the parent, and release the player (or don't choose the kid the following season). But we all know this also won't happen (for the most part). The same can be said for the club/coach as well. If you are with a top coach, club (or team), and you don't like the treatement, culture, playing time, or even simply fit for your child, most parents won't speak on the situation or leave the program. People tend to value success and wins over happiness. So you will always see posts from peopel who knew they were getting into a circumstance they might not enjoy, but chose to enter into that scenerio regardless. Unfortunately, they use the forum as a place to air out their greavences. Personlly, I think it's a good source of therapy for those individuals. Better here than seeing it spill onto the soccer pitch. By the way, if you know me in real life, i'm sure my username gives me away. lol Agree with all of that. And yes, pretty sure I know you . . . . |
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Post by allthingsoccer on Nov 4, 2021 19:40:13 GMT -5
Great answer tross2443
Many years on the sideline in multiple sports. Its all the same. Same crap different day/ sport.
Its a collective arrangement. Parents need to act like adults and "try" and solve the issues on the sideline. Plus parents need to check themselves. If you have issues (during games) wait at least 24/48 hrs before you go crazy on forums or emails....
We all have the same goal and that is the best interest in our players development.
Or
you can all get boxing gloves and have a backyard MMA. That seems to work as well.
This forum is to vent issues and hopefully provide light on situations.
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Post by mistergrinch on Nov 5, 2021 8:44:01 GMT -5
Interesting the difference in how sports are starting to treat this. Just saw an email blast that USATF (track and field) sent out.. announcing to every person who gets their emails that a coach was suspended under Safesport guidelines for bad behavior.
EVERY SINGLE USATF member in the country got this email.
..and for those who think that every kid at u15 and up can handle themselves, let me remind you of the various issues we're seeing when there's a power imbalance. College wrestlers and football players? PROFESSIONAL HOCKEY PLAYERS? Ever seen an NHL player up close? These aren't wimpy little kids - they're big tough dudes.. and they were abused due to a power imbalance.
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Post by georgiasoccerdad on Nov 8, 2021 10:05:48 GMT -5
Oldhat Q & A Q: When are parents supposed to come forward about problems? In an ideal world, as soon as you, the child's parent and the paying customer feel compelled to. However, don't say I didn't warn you, because in the real world there will most likely be retribution for the complaint. Q. If the coach refuses to have a sit down with the family is it appropriate for them to go to the DOC? If a paid professional coach refuses to meet privately, assuming the parent isn't waiting by coach's car and requested the meeting according to coach/club policy, then the parent should reach out to DOC. Q. What is inappropriate behavior for a coach? A. Well this is a loaded question. I have seen a lot. I think that they should be held to their club's code of conduct, ECNL has a Coach's Code of Conduct and US Youth Soccer as well. Lastly, IF you suspect verbal abuse including insulting, intimidating, threatening, shaming, demeaning, or derogatory language, among other forms of communication, it's your duty as a parent to report it. Perpetrators of verbal abuse often misuse their authority and prey on those in a subordinate position. Victims of verbal abuse are often told they are to blame for the abuser's behavior and reluctant to take action to end the abuse. Verbal abuse may lead to stress, depression, physical ailments, and other damage.(US Legal.com) THIS is why if a parent suspects verbal abuse, the U14 CHILD does not need to address the coach, or alleged abuser. Q. When does a coach cross the line in the treatment of a player? A. When your kid gets in the car after practice in tears, or when you tell them its time to get ready for practice/game and your player tells you they don't want to go. Parents know their kids best, you don't want to see your child suffer in silence to the point where they want to quit. Don't allow one lousy coach to steal your child's love of the game. If your child ALL OF A SUDDEN doesn't love soccer, and they have since they were 4, something has changed and a conversation needs to be had to figure out what's going on. Q. How are DOC's supposed to know when a coach is being inappropriate when DOC's are not at all practices and games? A. It needs to be reported to the DOC and then if nothing is done, whoever writes the DOC's six figure check should be contacted for a meeting. This is the answer right here. My daughter couldn't wait to get the field every day until she hit u14. The new coach was very condescending to players and overall a terrible communicator. Worst of all he was big into shaming girls for missed opps or "poor" performance. For the first time in her soccer life she asked if she had to go to practice. She wasn't the only one on the team- lots of girls were ready to head out to other clubs or quit the sport entirely. We had a scheduled meeting with all parents and the coach and several parents voiced concerns. Coach tried to play it off and actually said "We've already covered that". That's when parents had enough and demanded that he acknowledge and address the situation. That was his only season with our team as several families made it known that if he continued as coach they would leave. Thankfully the club understood the severity of the situation and made a change. Soccer became fun once again. Our daughter stayed with the club and never missed a practice. Yesterday her College team won their Conference tourney and she will play in the NCAAs next weekend as a Freshman. I fail to understand the audacity of clubs who will take your yearly fees, hound you for donations, and then be dismissive of concerns. What other business model treats it's customers in this fashion? Why should kids sports be any different? |
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Post by dadofthree on Nov 8, 2021 12:44:09 GMT -5
Oldhat Q & A Q: When are parents supposed to come forward about problems? In an ideal world, as soon as you, the child's parent and the paying customer feel compelled to. However, don't say I didn't warn you, because in the real world there will most likely be retribution for the complaint. Q. If the coach refuses to have a sit down with the family is it appropriate for them to go to the DOC? If a paid professional coach refuses to meet privately, assuming the parent isn't waiting by coach's car and requested the meeting according to coach/club policy, then the parent should reach out to DOC. Q. What is inappropriate behavior for a coach? A. Well this is a loaded question. I have seen a lot. I think that they should be held to their club's code of conduct, ECNL has a Coach's Code of Conduct and US Youth Soccer as well. Lastly, IF you suspect verbal abuse including insulting, intimidating, threatening, shaming, demeaning, or derogatory language, among other forms of communication, it's your duty as a parent to report it. Perpetrators of verbal abuse often misuse their authority and prey on those in a subordinate position. Victims of verbal abuse are often told they are to blame for the abuser's behavior and reluctant to take action to end the abuse. Verbal abuse may lead to stress, depression, physical ailments, and other damage.(US Legal.com) THIS is why if a parent suspects verbal abuse, the U14 CHILD does not need to address the coach, or alleged abuser. Q. When does a coach cross the line in the treatment of a player? A. When your kid gets in the car after practice in tears, or when you tell them its time to get ready for practice/game and your player tells you they don't want to go. Parents know their kids best, you don't want to see your child suffer in silence to the point where they want to quit. Don't allow one lousy coach to steal your child's love of the game. If your child ALL OF A SUDDEN doesn't love soccer, and they have since they were 4, something has changed and a conversation needs to be had to figure out what's going on. Q. How are DOC's supposed to know when a coach is being inappropriate when DOC's are not at all practices and games? A. It needs to be reported to the DOC and then if nothing is done, whoever writes the DOC's six figure check should be contacted for a meeting. This is the answer right here. My daughter couldn't wait to get the field every day until she hit u14. The new coach was very condescending to players and overall a terrible communicator. Worst of all he was big into shaming girls for missed opps or "poor" performance. For the first time in her soccer life she asked if she had to go to practice. She wasn't the only one on the team- lots of girls were ready to head out to other clubs or quit the sport entirely. We had a scheduled meeting with all parents and the coach and several parents voiced concerns. Coach tried to play it off and actually said "We've already covered that". That's when parents had enough and demanded that he acknowledge and address the situation. That was his only season with our team as several families made it known that if he continued as coach they would leave. Thankfully the club understood the severity of the situation and made a change. Soccer became fun once again. Our daughter stayed with the club and never missed a practice. Yesterday her College team won their Conference tourney and she will play in the NCAAs next weekend as a Freshman. I fail to understand the audacity of clubs who will take your yearly fees, hound you for donations, and then be dismissive of concerns. What other business model treats it's customers in this fashion? Why should kids sports be any different? First congrats on your daughter's conference championship. As a parent of a freshman playing, I know how proud you are of her and her teams accomplishment. The hard work paid off!! I can't agree more about how some clubs don't seem to understand who are the ultimate customers. If I did what they did I would be broke. The idea of paying literally thousands of dollars and then not wanting to have adult conversations with caring parents is beyond me. While I understand there are parents out there who are $@sholes (and they more times than not think their child is the next Messi), I think parents should have a say in their kids development. It has to be realistic with discussions with not one but multiple coaches who can give an opinion and then as a parent you have to accept the reality of their skill set. We talk with teachers in school, why not the soccer club coach. |
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Post by rifle on Nov 8, 2021 12:56:40 GMT -5
I know that a LOT of players walk away from club soccer as they get older. Going from gonzo super serious at academy and early select ages to other activities seemingly overnight. I think a fair amount of those are due to parents being into it more than the kids. I sure hope the situation above (where the coach is driving them away) is rare.
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Post by bogan on Nov 8, 2021 13:38:45 GMT -5
I know that a LOT of players walk away from club soccer as they get older. Going from gonzo super serious at academy and early select ages to other activities seemingly overnight. I think a fair amount of those are due to parents being into it more than the kids. I sure hope the situation above (where the coach is driving them away) is rare. Ha-reminds me of a guy whose kid was a terrific U-10 player…talked about how sure he was that his son would go pro some day. Went to every camp imaginable…kid stopped playing in 8th grade. |
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Post by slickdaddy96 on Nov 8, 2021 16:15:22 GMT -5
I know that a LOT of players walk away from club soccer as they get older. Going from gonzo super serious at academy and early select ages to other activities seemingly overnight. I think a fair amount of those are due to parents being into it more than the kids. I sure hope the situation above (where the coach is driving them away) is rare. Ha-reminds me of a guy whose kid was a terrific U-10 player…talked about how sure he was that his son would go pro some day. Went to every camp imaginable…kid stopped playing in 8th grade. Well first of all Bogan, congrats on becoming a moderator. I'm sure they won't give that to me!  Second of all would this kid and dad be on the southside or were you not always down that way? |
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Post by bogan on Nov 8, 2021 16:22:40 GMT -5
Ha-reminds me of a guy whose kid was a terrific U-10 player…talked about how sure he was that his son would go pro some day. Went to every camp imaginable…kid stopped playing in 8th grade. Well first of all Bogan, congrats on becoming a moderator. I'm sure they won't give that to me! Second of all would this kid and dad be on the southside or were you not always down that way? Thanks-I get to delete spam now! Yes-you are correct-I’m sure he played on your sons team. I’ve known his dad since I was a kid…he was going pro too… |
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Post by slickdaddy96 on Nov 8, 2021 16:44:31 GMT -5
Well first of all Bogan, congrats on becoming a moderator. I'm sure they won't give that to me! Second of all would this kid and dad be on the southside or were you not always down that way? Thanks-I get to delete spam now! Yes-you are correct-I’m sure he played on your sons team. I’ve known his dad since I was a kid…he was going pro too… I probably know who it was then. It is funny the things I have seen over the years. Lot of little Messi's in U10, U11, U12 either aren't playing anymore or the "weak" "bad" players (in the eyes of Little Messi's parents) from back then run circles around them now. |
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Post by dadofthree on Nov 8, 2021 19:10:14 GMT -5
I know that a LOT of players walk away from club soccer as they get older. Going from gonzo super serious at academy and early select ages to other activities seemingly overnight. I think a fair amount of those are due to parents being into it more than the kids. I sure hope the situation above (where the coach is driving them away) is rare. Rifle as a parent I think there are more coaches causing kids to quit than you think. As I think has been said here before many parents or kids don't say the real reason why they are leaving or not coming back since it might look bad on them. I know for my middle daughter she was about to give up as a U10 because of coaches and bs they did to her. That being said it was because of that she got on AW's team and as I have said before he is as good as it gets and basically is the reason she is playing D1. With that being said I do agree that there is a lot of the parent wants it and not the kids. Without their own desire they will never succeed as they have to give up too much as they grow up to not have the love of the game. |
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Post by oraclesfriend on Nov 8, 2021 19:47:52 GMT -5
I know that a LOT of players walk away from club soccer as they get older. Going from gonzo super serious at academy and early select ages to other activities seemingly overnight. I think a fair amount of those are due to parents being into it more than the kids. I sure hope the situation above (where the coach is driving them away) is rare. Rifle as a parent I think there are more coaches causing kids to quit than you think. As I think has been said here before many parents or kids don't say the real reason why they are leaving or not coming back since it might look bad on them. I know for my middle daughter she was about to give up as a U10 because of coaches and bs they did to her. That being said it was because of that she got on AW's team and as I have said before he is as good as it gets and basically is the reason she is playing D1. With that being said I do agree that there is a lot of the parent wants it and not the kids. Without their own desire they will never succeed as they have to give up too much as they grow up to not have the love of the game. I agree on the quitting due to coaches issue. I have known of several kids who had their love of the game killed by coaches. Sometimes it is due to the coaches being demeaning or lying to the kids (promising things and then not coming through) or showing blatant favoritism towards other kids. Sometimes it is due to just being a dud...boring, repetitive training sessions and lack of feedback. |
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