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Post by mightydawg on Jul 5, 2023 14:33:30 GMT -5
Current rule--a player is offside when they are in the opponents' half and, when the ball is played, any part of the body is closer to the opponents' goal line than both the ball and the second-last opponent.
New offside trial rule--the whole goal-scoring body of the player must be offside. If any part of the body is behind the last defender, the attacker will remain onside.
The new rule will be first used in Sweden with the nation's men's Under-21 and women's Under-19 leagues being used as testing grounds. The experiment will then move on to competitions in the Netherlands and Italy.
Will this lead to more scoring or will it lead to the end of high lines?
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Post by flix on Jul 5, 2023 15:17:04 GMT -5
Current rule--a player is offside when they are in the opponents' half and, when the ball is played, any part of the body is closer to the opponents' goal line than both the ball and the second-last opponent. New offside trial rule--the whole goal-scoring body of the player must be offside. If any part of the body is behind the last defender, the attacker will remain onside. The new rule will be first used in Sweden with the nation's men's Under-21 and women's Under-19 leagues being used as testing grounds. The experiment will then move on to competitions in the Netherlands and Italy. Will this lead to more scoring or will it lead to the end of high lines? I love it. Puffy Coat got this one right. I’m glad he is still involved in the game. |
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Post by soccerlegacy on Jul 5, 2023 17:40:16 GMT -5
Interesting. It still leaves a bit of subjective observation, though it just now favors the offense instead of the defense. Sound kinda like the rules they continually update in the NFL to produce more scoring. It would make for setting offside traps more difficult and high lines more risky, which in turn could lead to more scoring, which in my eyes means more entertaining, but I'm sure so purists could see it negatively.
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Post by rifle on Jul 5, 2023 18:08:53 GMT -5
Though it seems to only move the line by which you STILL have to split hairs.. I like it. How soon can we get VAR for every youth game?
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Post by bogan on Jul 5, 2023 18:24:20 GMT -5
Though it seems to only move the line by which you STILL have to split hairs.. I like it. How soon can we get VAR for every youth game? 🤣 |
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Post by soccerloafer on Jul 5, 2023 19:47:26 GMT -5
It makes a ton of sense.
I've taken heat here before for explaining how I call offside - has to be clear and obvious and provide an advantage - which is the SPIRIT of the rule. No cherry picking, etc.
By over defining the rule, it's become much more technical than subjective. Super easy to call with VAR, hard AF to call in real time with real (not professional) referees in real games. But her pony tail held her on..., his kneecap was in front of the defenders ear... ok, really.
I'm all for making it easier and less nit-picky. Bring the hate, I'm sure it's out there...
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Post by GameOfThrow-ins on Jul 5, 2023 20:02:34 GMT -5
Great. More people on here will be complaining about speed and athleticism in the game, not to mention that if you don’t have speed and athleticism on defense you can forget a high line and might even have to bring back, arghhhhhh, The Sweeper!
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Post by bogan on Jul 5, 2023 20:10:34 GMT -5
“… not to mention that if you don’t have speed and athleticism on defense you can forget a high line and might even have to bring back, arghhhhhh, The Sweeper!”
When this was announced I told my son this, and he had no idea what I was talking about (sweeper).🤣
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Post by Deleted on Jul 5, 2023 21:14:34 GMT -5
“… not to mention that if you don’t have speed and athleticism on defense you can forget a high line and might even have to bring back, arghhhhhh, The Sweeper!” When this was announced I told my son this, and he had no idea what I was talking about (sweeper).🤣 Can't have a sweeper without a stopper. |
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Post by bolo on Jul 6, 2023 8:41:13 GMT -5
Though it seems to only move the line by which you STILL have to split hairs.. I like it. How soon can we get VAR for every youth game? Exactly. I don't think this will change anything about the way defense is played- even at the highest levels- because you're still talking about a matter of inches between on & off, which no player is really good enough to plan or account for. "I made the run when I did because I knew my trailing foot would still be behind the edge of the defender's butt as I ran by as fast as I could while guessing when my teammate would actually pass the ball." Even calls now in professional leagues that don't require VAR are generally within 3-9 inches of being on- that's really close in the grand scheme of things. I also agree that for close calls in youth games, with non-professional refs and no video, it's impossible to get it exactly right every time. But don't tell that to parents- especially those that are seated on the opposite end of where an offside call was or wasn't made that could clearly tell (better than the AR) that little Logan was onside by a mile! |
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Post by rifle on Jul 6, 2023 11:05:12 GMT -5
Great. A new reason to drag a foot.. to remain onside rather than to seek contact from a defender.
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Post by GameOfThrow-ins on Jul 6, 2023 11:44:06 GMT -5
Though it seems to only move the line by which you STILL have to split hairs.. I like it. How soon can we get VAR for every youth game? Exactly. I don't think this will change anything about the way defense is played- even at the highest levels- because you're still talking about a matter of inches between on & off, which no player is really good enough to plan or account for. "I made the run when I did because I knew my trailing foot would still be behind the edge of the defender's butt as I ran by as fast as I could while guessing when my teammate would actually pass the ball." Even calls now in professional leagues that don't require VAR are generally within 3-9 inches of being on- that's really close in the grand scheme of things. I also agree that for close calls in youth games, with non-professional refs and no video, it's impossible to get it exactly right every time. But don't tell that to parents- especially those that are seated on the opposite end of where an offside call was or wasn't made that could clearly tell (better than the AR) that little Logan was onside by a mile! I don’t know. The impetus is on the defense to adapt. If they don’t and offensive players keep doing what they do as well, past data indicates that 4 offside call average per game will be reduced to 2 per game. And we all know that even a single step or even half step offside with the old rule resulted in a disallowed goal the majority of the time. It will be interesting to see how it turns out. |
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Post by notcrazysoccerdad on Jul 6, 2023 12:56:35 GMT -5
I am neither here nor there on the rule, but I can already hear the uneducated parents screaming because they don't know that it has(or hasn't) been implemented in youth soccer.
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Post by bogan on Jul 6, 2023 14:12:44 GMT -5
“… not to mention that if you don’t have speed and athleticism on defense you can forget a high line and might even have to bring back, arghhhhhh, The Sweeper!” When this was announced I told my son this, and he had no idea what I was talking about (sweeper).🤣 Can't have a sweeper without a stopper. I feel old… |
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Post by mightydawg on Jul 6, 2023 15:27:06 GMT -5
At the boys ECNL showcase, I actually saw several teams using the stopper and sweeper quite well. Middle was jammed and the outside backs stayed compact. Gave up some space on the outside but it worked very well.
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Post by GameOfThrow-ins on Jul 6, 2023 16:33:24 GMT -5
At the boys ECNL showcase, I actually saw several teams using the stopper and sweeper quite well. Middle was jammed and the outside backs stayed compact. Gave up some space on the outside but it worked very well. A lot of teams that play 4 across the back with 2 CBs have one of the CBs take on the striker more forward while the other shifts a bit to cover. Are you saying you saw teams play an actual diamond defensive formation like my wife’s 80s high school team? |
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Post by mightydawg on Jul 6, 2023 16:57:44 GMT -5
At the boys ECNL showcase, I actually saw several teams using the stopper and sweeper quite well. Middle was jammed and the outside backs stayed compact. Gave up some space on the outside but it worked very well. A lot of teams that play 4 across the back with 2 CBs have one of the CBs take on the striker more forward while the other shifts a bit to cover. Are you saying you saw teams play an actual diamond defensive formation like my wife’s 80s high school team? Yep. It was a diamond formation at all times. Brought back memories of my childhood. |
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Post by bogan on Jul 6, 2023 17:31:18 GMT -5
A lot of teams that play 4 across the back with 2 CBs have one of the CBs take on the striker more forward while the other shifts a bit to cover. Are you saying you saw teams play an actual diamond defensive formation like my wife’s 80s high school team? Yep. It was a diamond formation at all times. Brought back memories of my childhood. Was Sir Alex in attendance? 😎 |
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Post by dabe on Jul 6, 2023 19:35:57 GMT -5
I feel like we're operating at the extremes here. First someone's fingernail qualified them as off and now it may keep them on, especially with the use of VAR. If there's a clear advantage then someone should be qualified as off, albeit the rule would be pretty subjective.
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Post by rifle on Jul 7, 2023 5:11:18 GMT -5
I feel like we're operating at the extremes here. First someone's fingernail qualified them as off and now it may keep them on, especially with the use of VAR. If there's a clear advantage then someone should be qualified as off, albeit the rule would be pretty subjective. The recent 7v7 tournament was pretty entertaining without offside. Wayne Rooney already has his keeper playing sweeper. The message is clear: We need to get rid of offside. /s |
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Post by bogan on Jul 7, 2023 14:03:05 GMT -5
I feel like we're operating at the extremes here. First someone's fingernail qualified them as off and now it may keep them on, especially with the use of VAR. If there's a clear advantage then someone should be qualified as off, albeit the rule would be pretty subjective. The recent 7v7 tournament was pretty entertaining without offside. Wayne Rooney already has his keeper playing sweeper. The message is clear: We need to get rid of offside. /s …then you could do away with the ARs and just have one referee per match. Ref shortages will be a thing of the past! (Sarcasm font: on) |
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Post by oraclesfriend on Jul 7, 2023 14:10:30 GMT -5
A lot of teams that play 4 across the back with 2 CBs have one of the CBs take on the striker more forward while the other shifts a bit to cover. Are you saying you saw teams play an actual diamond defensive formation like my wife’s 80s high school team? Yep. It was a diamond formation at all times. Brought back memories of my childhood. So for these teams employing a diamond defense, what did their midfield and offense look like? When I was in HS we had two strikers and two wingers and they stayed high all of the time. Basically the midfielders covered anything wide defensively. |
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Post by mightydawg on Jul 7, 2023 14:38:59 GMT -5
Yep. It was a diamond formation at all times. Brought back memories of my childhood. So for these teams employing a diamond defense, what did their midfield and offense look like? When I was in HS we had two strikers and two wingers and they stayed high all of the time. Basically the midfielders covered anything wide defensively. I don't completely remember the formation up top but do remember they put a lot of pressure up top and through the middle with the other 6. This forced a number of long balls into the teeth of the defense. |
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Post by Respect on Jul 8, 2023 8:33:25 GMT -5
I feel like we're operating at the extremes here. First someone's fingernail qualified them as off and now it may keep them on, especially with the use of VAR. If there's a clear advantage then someone should be qualified as off, albeit the rule would be pretty subjective. Fingernails are not part of the scoring part of the body and should be ignored when determining offside position (with the current or planned updates). But to your point, perhaps simply stating that the whole body (not just the scoring part of the body) needs to be ahead of ball and second to last defender to be considered an offside position would make for simpler judgment call on the AR. |
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