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Post by GameOfThrow-ins on May 7, 2021 19:56:14 GMT -5
Get you calculators out. I wonder if the pressure from all the clubs in the tables they screwed up by playing different age groups against different teams finally won out. Also hearing no ECNL for AU next year.
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Post by ecnlquestions on May 7, 2021 20:51:49 GMT -5
I wonder if this was always the intention from the beginning of the season? It was always unrealistic to think AU teams would be attending Nationals with the other commitments they have. Hopefully they can clear the table up quickly so teams can see where they stand. I haven’t looked but I’m sure this may affect national playoffs in some of the age groups.
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Post by Soccerhouse on May 7, 2021 21:40:16 GMT -5
Yikes. It’s a bad look for sure.
I heard late fall they were being forced out of ecnl because of these issues and would not be allowed to return for the 2021-2022 season.
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Post by GameOfThrow-ins on May 7, 2021 21:50:10 GMT -5
If really true, it changes conference standings, playoff seedings, and even puts teams that thought they didn’t make the playoffs back in them. Those teams could probably use some practice sessions and since ECNL is not releasing playoff seedings/groupings until June 23rd, it would probably be best for all involved to get the official notification ASAP.
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Post by Brinker on May 8, 2021 6:56:23 GMT -5
So let me gets this straight, teams that beat Atl get to lose points they already won, while teams that lost to Atl have no consequences since they had no points anyway. This will skew results in a strange way. Why not just have the forfeit rules apply and Atl loses all remaining games 3-0 so all current results still apply.
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Post by flix on May 8, 2021 7:40:04 GMT -5
What age groups are you referring to as being messed up by AU playing different teams?
U18/19 AU 2nd place playoff
U16 AU 4th place playoff
U15 AU 1st place playoff
U14 AU 7th place
So I assume you are referring to u14 age group but how many times did the true u14 team play? Maybe 3 times? All the other matches were played by the 13’s.
I remember when AU first began ECNL play, no results were posted and people lost their minds. A lot of people thought they were just exhibition type matches meant to give a club more matches. Then they started counting the matches and people were complaining about which team they played as it wasn’t fair some teams played a different AU squad. The only teams the 14’s beat were CF Plat (we all remember the infamous cheating with bio-banded players) Tennessee (True 07’s)and Chattanooga while drawing with FC Alliance and CF Prem. The top three teams all played the 13’s and won, so what’s the issue (if the rumor is even true)?
And comments have been made about the Unite Cup. That’s great NASA made the finals in all age groups but let’s not forget that for whatever reason GSA was not involved, which I’m sure would have changed at least one final (u14 at the minimum). I don’t think them making the finals is more impressive than AU winning it but AU is always in a lose/lose position and always will. A couple comments about NASA 14’s playing AU close is a farce. Anyone knows that soccer is the only sport you can have 80 to 90 percent of possession, absolutely dominate a match, make a few subs and then the other team scores. I have yet to see that team connect five passes, however, they are very good on set pieces.
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Post by GameOfThrow-ins on May 8, 2021 7:57:04 GMT -5
So let me gets this straight, teams that beat Atl get to lose points they already won, while teams that lost to Atl have no consequences since they had no points anyway. This will skew results in a strange way. Why not just have the forfeit rules apply and Atl loses all remaining games 3-0 so all current results still apply. Joking? No, NASA 07s or whomever, you don’t get to keep your win over AU 08s while others just eliminate the loss to AU 07s. But look on the bright side NASA 05s would move from 3rd to 1st. It’s the same thing up and down the age groups. AU skewed the standings across them all. With the exception of their 05s, AU can not win playing up against mid to top table ECNL teams. They won’t be able to finish their league game schedules at this point and you can’t just have them say bye-bye and pick and choose which games to count. If their out, they should be all out. |
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Post by soccerballz on May 8, 2021 7:59:13 GMT -5
Where things got screwed up with AU in ECNL is; GSA/AFU would play the 07s,, but Concorde and NASA would play the 06s. Happened at every age group. GSA could get a win and that can be the difference of making the playoffs or not. I would just like consistency across the games so the standings are meaningful. Used more as development for AU which is great, but everyone should be playing the same kids if standings count.
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Post by GameOfThrow-ins on May 8, 2021 8:06:55 GMT -5
What age groups are you referring to as being messed up by AU playing different teams? U18/19 AU 2nd place playoff U16 AU 4th place playoff U15 AU 1st place playoff U14 AU 7th place So I assume you are referring to u14 age group but how many times did the true u14 team play? Maybe 3 times? All the other matches were played by the 13’s. I remember when AU first began ECNL play, no results were posted and people lost their minds. A lot of people thought they were just exhibition type matches meant to give a club more matches. Then they started counting the matches and people were complaining about which team they played as it wasn’t fair some teams played a different AU squad. The only teams the 14’s beat were CF Plat (we all remember the infamous cheating with bio-banded players) Tennessee (True 07’s)and Chattanooga while drawing with FC Alliance and CF Prem. The top three teams all played the 13’s and won, so what’s the issue (if the rumor is even true)? And comments have been made about the Unite Cup. That’s great NASA made the finals in all age groups but let’s not forget that for whatever reason GSA was not involved, which I’m sure would have changed at least one final (u14 at the minimum). I don’t think them making the finals is more impressive than AU winning it but AU is always in a lose/lose position and always will. A couple comments about NASA 14’s playing AU close is a farce. Anyone knows that soccer is the only sport you can have 80 to 90 percent of possession, absolutely dominate a match, make a few subs and then the other team scores. I have yet to see that team connect five passes, however, they are very good on set pieces. Here’s the easiest example I can give you: 05 Alabama beats AU 06s (didn’t play second game); 05 NASA loses to AU 05s (didn’t play second game) Alabama in first, NASA in third. Remove AU results and NASA in first Alabama in second; NASA goes from 2.11 PPG to 2.22 PPG - huge implications for playoff seeding. |
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Post by newposter on May 8, 2021 9:20:27 GMT -5
From a quick review, it looks like GSA has a qualified team in each division but one. All would have qualified except composite even without AU leaving. I would say that is a good season for the club.
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Post by GameOfThrow-ins on May 8, 2021 10:21:46 GMT -5
From a quick review, it looks like GSA has a qualified team in each division but one. All would have qualified except composite even without AU leaving. I would say that is a good season for the club. The GSA 05s were out in 6th. They would sneak in at 5th now. |
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Post by newposter on May 8, 2021 11:19:22 GMT -5
Good for them. Thought only top 4 qualified? If they did qualify, having all age groups in is a feather in GSAs cap.
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Post by GameOfThrow-ins on May 8, 2021 12:16:16 GMT -5
Good for them. Thought only top 4 qualified? If they did qualify, having all age groups in is a feather in GSAs cap. Yes, the number of qualifying teams is different for each age group. The U16s go 5 deep. From what I hear the GSA 05s will have an injection of talent for next year while their 07s will be raided by AU. |
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Post by rudy on May 8, 2021 12:41:13 GMT -5
Anyone know why AU did this?
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Post by Futsal Gawdess on May 8, 2021 12:57:36 GMT -5
Good for them. Thought only top 4 qualified? If they did qualify, having all age groups in is a feather in GSAs cap. Yes, the number of qualifying teams is different for each age group. The U16s go 5 deep. From what I hear the GSA 05s will have an injection of talent for next year while their 07s will be raided by AU. Hearing that at least 5 former AU 05s in all 3 phases of the game, are looking to form an Avengers Endgame team at GSA next year. That should also attract other local talent to form a super team that will get all the looks and attention from scouts n Colleges in such a pivotal year. Good for them, I'm surprised other clubs haven't thought of doing this in the past outside of NASA... In regards to AU and ECNL, I was told that the real goal of AU was to get as close to real games in play for their teams, since the restrictions of travel with MLS Next did not allow for traditional travel or challenging games with the dissolution of DA and local competition moving to ECNL. This is why they never went to ECNL showcases, never fielded real age-group specific teams or the same line up in back to back games and only played ECNL games when MLS Next games were not on their schedule. I personally think it made for a more competitive season and fodder for watercooler discussions... From what I've been told AU is more concerned about their own Showcase later this month, where 10 other MLS clubs are coming into town to play each other and the MLS-Next Showcase/Playoffs occurring at the end of June through the 4th of July at the home of FC Dallas... |
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Post by rudy on May 8, 2021 13:08:19 GMT -5
Thanks for the information. I'd like to see real age AU teams play top metro Atlanta ECNL teams in a showcase. We know it wont happen and not because of ECNL teams.
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Post by ecnlquestions on May 8, 2021 13:18:48 GMT -5
Thanks for the information. I'd like to see real age AU teams play top metro Atlanta ECNL teams in a showcase. We know it wont happen and not because of ECNL teams. Didn’t that happen in the Unite cup? Let’s give AU some credit, although local clubs on their day can put up a fight against them there is still a big gulf in quality. I’m interested to see where players land this year, do they move to teams where the other top players are going (we know this doesn’t always work out) or are they going to try and find the right coaching fit. |
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Post by ecnlquestions on May 8, 2021 13:20:21 GMT -5
Good for them. Thought only top 4 qualified? If they did qualify, having all age groups in is a feather in GSAs cap. Yes, the number of qualifying teams is different for each age group. The U16s go 5 deep. From what I hear the GSA 05s will have an injection of talent for next year while their 07s will be raided by AU. It will be interesting to see how many players GSA 07s lose. That team went under the radar at the start of the season. |
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Post by Futsal Gawdess on May 8, 2021 13:21:15 GMT -5
So let me gets this straight, teams that beat Atl get to lose points they already won, while teams that lost to Atl have no consequences since they had no points anyway. This will skew results in a strange way. Why not just have the forfeit rules apply and Atl loses all remaining games 3-0 so all current results still apply. This is honestly a simple fix. I say remove ALL results vs the Atlanta United teams, that way whether you won or lost against them, or didn't get to play them is irrelevant... |
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Post by Futsal Gawdess on May 8, 2021 13:25:09 GMT -5
Thanks for the information. I'd like to see real age AU teams play top metro Atlanta ECNL teams in a showcase. We know it wont happen and not because of ECNL teams. Hopefully this will be an on-going theme in the Unite Youth Cup going forward...🤞 |
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Post by soccerparent02 on May 8, 2021 13:27:02 GMT -5
Checked Unite Cup teams. Not to be disrespectful but several participants are not in the top club conversations. A couple age groups missing several of the known top clubs.
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Post by Soccerhouse on May 8, 2021 13:30:04 GMT -5
no local club has the depth of Atlanta united. but that doesn't mean you ruin the integrity of the league for your own good. at least offer some level of communication to clubs and explain and justify your randomness. I saw a few games in person that it was utter embarrassing that AU tried to send out their younger squad against some local competition. and I've seen the flip side where there age appropriate players destroy a local team -- all i'm saying is this, when a team is top 1-3 in the standings don't try to be cute and send your kids 1 to 2 years younger to play them. It truly gives the impression that you have zero respect for that club your playing against.
and then the entire rumors of them playing players down an age group, not sure if that was ever confirmed or not, but that was when the AU results were not counting towards the standings, then like a magic wand, results started to appear.
if au wanted to do what they were doing, there results should never have landed in a table and I think everyone would have been fine with it from the start.
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Post by Futsal Gawdess on May 8, 2021 13:42:18 GMT -5
no local club has the depth of Atlanta united. but that doesn't mean you ruin the integrity of the league for your own good. at least offer some level of communication to clubs and explain and justify your randomness. I saw a few games in person that it was utter embarrassing that AU tried to send out their younger squad against some local competition. and I've seen the flip side where there age appropriate players destroy a local team -- all i'm saying is this, when a team is top 1-3 in the standings don't try to be cute and send your kids 1 to 2 years younger to play them. It truly gives the impression that you have zero respect for that club your playing against. and then the entire rumors of them playing players down an age group, not sure if that was ever confirmed or not, but that was when the AU results were not counting towards the standings, then like a magic wand, results started to appear. if au wanted to do what they were doing, there results should never have landed in a table and I think everyone would have been fine with it from the start. I don't know if AU ever played down players, there are folks here who have kids AU that could better answer those questions. I agree that maybe a conversation should have been had like used to occur back in the U12 years of DA, where it was top team vs top team or mixed vs mixed. However, I disagree that it's disrespectful to play up your younger talented players at AU. They have a different mandate. They have to push their better players and who better than against older, faster and more talented boys. They lose oh well, they win, give them a bigger challenge. At the end of it all, AU knows that the loss will still stand for the record, but they would have gotten to see how their players stack up... |
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Post by soccerparent02 on May 8, 2021 14:02:14 GMT -5
I would question roster integrity. I thought each team was required to submit a roster that is checked before each game. With a very few exceptions for an occasional guest player, the roster does not change. If one team has carte blanche on roster changes, then all do and are free to do whatever they want. If they want to play u13 at u14, then do it every game.
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Post by GameOfThrow-ins on May 8, 2021 14:44:06 GMT -5
“Hearing that at least 5 former AU 05s in all 3 phases of the game, are looking to form an Avengers Endgame team at GSA next year. That should also attract other local talent to form a super team that will get all the looks and attention from scouts n Colleges in such a pivotal year.”
There is another club besides GSA that is in the running for the Avengers. It’s not quite neck and neck yet, but certainly not a long shot either. I guess whichever club soothes their egos the most (he said euphemistically) will be granted their services.
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Post by GameOfThrow-ins on May 8, 2021 14:51:08 GMT -5
Checked Unite Cup teams. Not to be disrespectful but several participants are not in the top club conversations. A couple age groups missing several of the known top clubs. Some clubs were invited and declined. Some clubs used to tourney as an extended tryout for next year and mixed players from different branches and teams, some clubs were just happy to be there, one club used it for scouting, and another club thought it was an actual competition and made it to the finals. |
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Post by soccerparent02 on May 8, 2021 19:25:55 GMT -5
Those are generalities. My point is that the top club teams were not all there. Several listed are second and third tier clubs at older ages.
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Post by GameOfThrow-ins on May 8, 2021 19:35:13 GMT -5
AU, UFA, CF, NASA, SSA, AFU, LSA, and even Inter & KSA were in. GSA said no thanks. Who do you think is left out?
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Post by soccerparent02 on May 9, 2021 8:30:10 GMT -5
I think the fact that it appears from posters that teams were mixed used as "tryouts", etc. says it all. It was not clear if the top teams from the big clubs played.
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Post by GameOfThrow-ins on May 9, 2021 9:21:34 GMT -5
I think the fact that it appears from posters that teams were mixed used as "tryouts", etc. says it all. It was not clear if the top teams from the big clubs played. What are you talking about, man! I watched multiple age groups and multiple games - whether or not clubs mixed in players, they did so to win/field their best possible team. Nobody had their lower teams play. The top teams played. Period. I don’t get your angle. Are you ticked that clubs like Santos, Rush, Ambush, All-In, and Chico’s Bail Bonds didn’t play? |
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