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Post by atlantasoccerdad2020 on Oct 10, 2022 0:06:00 GMT -5
Respectfully, I think the boys did decide the outcome. Concorde controlled the game and even scored playing with a man down. 3-0 is a decisive win. Not sure what happened but that NASA 08-team is a shell of what I remember from last year. To think both Concorde Platinum and NASA have a loss to the same AFU team. Platinum loss was on a PK Saturday in a very good game. |
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Post by rifle on Oct 10, 2022 5:23:28 GMT -5
Two Concorde and NASA players got tangled up halfway into the 1st half. NASA player gets a red, Concorde player initially gets a yellow. After conferring with the AR on the other half of the field (🤷🏻♂️), ref changes Concorde player’s yellow to straight red. Later in the half, Concorde player gets a second yellow for a foul so half finishes with 10 NASA players, 9 Concorde players. With 5-10 minutes left in the 2nd half, NASA player gets two yellow cards back to back for mouthing off to the ref. Both teams finish with 9 on the field. Concorde 3, NASA 0. pretty typical to ask the AR what s/he saw in a “tangled up” situation. |
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Post by NotherSoccerParent on Oct 10, 2022 6:36:18 GMT -5
Two Concorde and NASA players got tangled up halfway into the 1st half. NASA player gets a red, Concorde player initially gets a yellow. After conferring with the AR on the other half of the field (🤷🏻♂️), ref changes Concorde player’s yellow to straight red. Later in the half, Concorde player gets a second yellow for a foul so half finishes with 10 NASA players, 9 Concorde players. With 5-10 minutes left in the 2nd half, NASA player gets two yellow cards back to back for mouthing off to the ref. Both teams finish with 9 on the field. Concorde 3, NASA 0. pretty typical to ask the AR what s/he saw in a “tangled up” situation. Yes, the AR on the side where any incident occurs should provide his or her input to the ref. However, in this case, it was the AR on the other half of the field AND other side of the field who came over to the ref, provided his "input," which resulted in changing the yellow card to a red for the Concorde player. In a situation where you have a seasoned ref who is an AR for a game and a relatively new ref, I think it is completely appropriate for the seasoned ref (who is AR) to help or mentor the ref. The ref in this game did not seem "new" and was very decisive in his initial carding; red for NASA player (for pushing the player down and kicking at him) and yellow for Concorde player. Just odd that the AR who had direct sight said nothing and the AR on the opposite side of the action interjected. |
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Post by NotherSoccerParent on Oct 10, 2022 6:46:16 GMT -5
Respectfully, I think the boys did decide the outcome. Concorde controlled the game and even scored playing with a man down. 3-0 is a decisive win. Not sure what happened but that NASA 08-team is a shell of what I remember from last year. You are correct. NASA played essentially half the game (if not a little more) with one man up so they certainly had the advantage but could not capitalize. Teams succeed when they treat each other as teammates and play as a team. Kids become better players when they know what they have to improve on. Parents can support their kids when they know what is going on with team. None of this is going on, hence the drastic turnaround from last year. |
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Post by onekickpop on Oct 10, 2022 7:34:22 GMT -5
This is why I love this game! Select 11 from 18 rostered kids and throw them on the field. There is no single player that determines the game. Coach strategy, player ability, player communication, team synergy, team fitness/injury, etc. so much comes into play when you consider team success. Look at AU. After their loss this weekend they appear to point to constant injury as part of the reason they did not do well this season, yet still they have a super high dollar talented roster.
There is good competition here in the SE. you do well, expect every team to try and bring their “A” game against you because they are gunning for that title. Every team wants to sit on top and win a national title (which NASA almost did last year). The reality is that this competition makes the boys/girls better players. This is not a sport where only one player makes a difference.
For the sake of comparison, AU academy travels the SE and plays against MLSNEXT teams. My assumption is every game is a blowout and it truly isn’t even as competitive as it can be. Not sure I would enjoy the game as much if the boys were playing repetitive games and losing against the local MLS club constantly. I don’t see that as development.
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Post by forumguy on Oct 10, 2022 8:00:54 GMT -5
Respectfully, I think the boys did decide the outcome. Concorde controlled the game and even scored playing with a man down. 3-0 is a decisive win. Not sure what happened but that NASA 08-team is a shell of what I remember from last year. You are correct. NASA played essentially half the game (if not a little more) with one man up so they certainly had the advantage but could not capitalize. Teams succeed when they treat each other as teammates and play as a team. Kids become better players when they know what they have to improve on. Parents can support their kids when they know what is going on with team. None of this is going on, hence the drastic turnaround from last year. Question: Isn't this the same coach as last year? How are things different if it's the same coach? Is there new players? New parent dynamic? What has changed on this team that they are so different from last year? |
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Post by Brinker on Oct 10, 2022 8:03:06 GMT -5
This is why I love this game! Select 11 from 18 rostered kids and throw them on the field. There is no single player that determines the game. Coach strategy, player ability, player communication, team synergy, team fitness/injury, etc. so much comes into play when you consider team success. Look at AU. After their loss this weekend they appear to point to constant injury as part of the reason they did not do well this season, yet still they have a super high dollar talented roster. There is good competition here in the SE. you do well, expect every team to try and bring their “A” game against you because they are gunning for that title. Every team wants to sit on top and win a national title (which NASA almost did last year). The reality is that this competition makes the boys/girls better players. This is not a sport where only one player makes a difference. For the sake of comparison, AU academy travels the SE and plays against MLSNEXT teams. My assumption is every game is a blowout and it truly isn’t even as competitive as it can be. Not sure I would enjoy the game as much if the boys were playing repetitive games and losing against the local MLS club constantly. I don’t see that as development. AU Academy played Hoover Vestavia Alabama and I know one game was 6-0 at half and AU pulled out their top players in the second half to keep the score down. MLSNEXT games seem to be blowout wins for AU, credit to them, but doesn’t seem productive. NASA’s ECNL overall club championship was so impressive and difficult to repeat since the SE ECNL has so much competition with Platinum, UFA, GSA, CESA and Surf. I don’t see one club finishing top of table at most age groups again like NASA did last year. |
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Post by atlantasoccerdad2020 on Oct 10, 2022 8:36:07 GMT -5
This is why I love this game! Select 11 from 18 rostered kids and throw them on the field. There is no single player that determines the game. Coach strategy, player ability, player communication, team synergy, team fitness/injury, etc. so much comes into play when you consider team success. Look at AU. After their loss this weekend they appear to point to constant injury as part of the reason they did not do well this season, yet still they have a super high dollar talented roster. There is good competition here in the SE. you do well, expect every team to try and bring their “A” game against you because they are gunning for that title. Every team wants to sit on top and win a national title (which NASA almost did last year). The reality is that this competition makes the boys/girls better players. This is not a sport where only one player makes a difference. For the sake of comparison, AU academy travels the SE and plays against MLSNEXT teams. My assumption is every game is a blowout and it truly isn’t even as competitive as it can be. Not sure I would enjoy the game as much if the boys were playing repetitive games and losing against the local MLS club constantly. I don’t see that as development. AU Academy played Hoover Vestavia Alabama and I know one game was 6-0 at half and AU pulled out their top players in the second half to keep the score down. MLSNEXT games seem to be blowout wins for AU, credit to them, but doesn’t seem productive. NASA’s ECNL overall club championship was so impressive and difficult to repeat since the SE ECNL has so much competition with Platinum, UFA, GSA, CESA and Surf. I don’t see one club finishing top of table at most age groups again like NASA did last year. “credit to them, but doesn’t seem productive” This is exactly why some people have turned down offers to play at AU. It’s possible to be too good of a team at a young age. |
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Post by atlantasoccerdad2020 on Oct 10, 2022 8:37:22 GMT -5
You are correct. NASA played essentially half the game (if not a little more) with one man up so they certainly had the advantage but could not capitalize. Teams succeed when they treat each other as teammates and play as a team. Kids become better players when they know what they have to improve on. Parents can support their kids when they know what is going on with team. None of this is going on, hence the drastic turnaround from last year. Question: Isn't this the same coach as last year? How are things different if it's the same coach? Is there new players? New parent dynamic? What has changed on this team that they are so different from last year? They are kids and grow and mature. Gain interest and lose interest. If we were talking about AI it would be a different story. |
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Post by forumguy on Oct 10, 2022 9:10:52 GMT -5
You may be correct, and more than likely you are. However, nothersoccerparent seemed to imply they have inside info on this team why things have changed. Just curious as their post seemed a little vague
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Post by NotherSoccerParent on Oct 10, 2022 9:47:26 GMT -5
You are correct. NASA played essentially half the game (if not a little more) with one man up so they certainly had the advantage but could not capitalize. Teams succeed when they treat each other as teammates and play as a team. Kids become better players when they know what they have to improve on. Parents can support their kids when they know what is going on with team. None of this is going on, hence the drastic turnaround from last year. Question: Isn't this the same coach as last year? How are things different if it's the same coach? Is there new players? New parent dynamic? What has changed on this team that they are so different from last year? 1. Same coach as last year. His coaching style is either love it or hate it, no in between. That style seems to be catching up to him bc if a kid doesn’t respond to his methods, they may shut down and lose their interest in soccer. 2. I don’t know the exact number but I think they got rid of and brought in 4 new players. They biggest thing they don’t have this year are their trap players, who they benefitted from greatly last year. 3. Parent dynamic was never good on this team. After U12 SCCL, the U13 ECNL team was a combination of Metro/Noonday players and Milton players. There was a clear preference during the U13 season by the coach for Milton players which perpetuated a separation between players and parents. I don’t know for sure if that has continued but I do know that there are many unhappy parents. It’s like a marriage. Existing problems really surface when other things start falling apart. |
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Post by parkthebus on Oct 10, 2022 11:44:05 GMT -5
Question: Isn't this the same coach as last year? How are things different if it's the same coach? Is there new players? New parent dynamic? What has changed on this team that they are so different from last year? 1. Same coach as last year. His coaching style is either love it or hate it, no in between. That style seems to be catching up to him bc if a kid doesn’t respond to his methods, they may shut down and lose their interest in soccer. 2. I don’t know the exact number but I think they got rid of and brought in 4 new players. They biggest thing they don’t have this year are their trap players, who they benefitted from greatly last year. 3. Parent dynamic was never good on this team. After U12 SCCL, the U13 ECNL team was a combination of Metro/Noonday players and Milton players. There was a clear preference during the U13 season by the coach for Milton players which perpetuated a separation between players and parents. I don’t know for sure if that has continued but I do know that there are many unhappy parents. It’s like a marriage. Existing problems really surface when other things start falling apart. Out of curiosity… What’s his coaching style? |
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Post by rifle on Oct 10, 2022 11:53:40 GMT -5
pretty typical to ask the AR what s/he saw in a “tangled up” situation. Yes, the AR on the side where any incident occurs should provide his or her input to the ref. However, in this case, it was the AR on the other half of the field AND other side of the field who came over to the ref, provided his "input," which resulted in changing the yellow card to a red for the Concorde player. In a situation where you have a seasoned ref who is an AR for a game and a relatively new ref, I think it is completely appropriate for the seasoned ref (who is AR) to help or mentor the ref. The ref in this game did not seem "new" and was very decisive in his initial carding; red for NASA player (for pushing the player down and kicking at him) and yellow for Concorde player. Just odd that the AR who had direct sight said nothing and the AR on the opposite side of the action interjected. I wasn’t there but I do referee and you can’t see everything - sometimes even if you’re “right there”. From the fan sideline, you have no idea what they can and cannot see. If your kid got elbowed in the head and the CR and nearest AR couldn’t see it because of sight lines (and sneaky players exploiting those sight lines).. and the other AR did see it.. wouldn’t you want the right call to be made? |
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Post by NotherSoccerParent on Oct 10, 2022 12:02:04 GMT -5
Yes, the AR on the side where any incident occurs should provide his or her input to the ref. However, in this case, it was the AR on the other half of the field AND other side of the field who came over to the ref, provided his "input," which resulted in changing the yellow card to a red for the Concorde player. In a situation where you have a seasoned ref who is an AR for a game and a relatively new ref, I think it is completely appropriate for the seasoned ref (who is AR) to help or mentor the ref. The ref in this game did not seem "new" and was very decisive in his initial carding; red for NASA player (for pushing the player down and kicking at him) and yellow for Concorde player. Just odd that the AR who had direct sight said nothing and the AR on the opposite side of the action interjected. I wasn’t there but I do referee and you can’t see everything - sometimes even if you’re “right there”. From the fan sideline, you have no idea what they can and cannot see. If your kid got elbowed in the head and the CR and nearest AR couldn’t see it because of sight lines (and sneaky players exploiting those sight lines).. and the other AR did see it.. wouldn’t you want the right call to be made? I would want the correct call to be made. Being a ref is tough and no one is perfect which is why I appreciate everyone who still gives their time to do this, regardless of whether or not I agree with their calls all the time. That’s why I did not condemn the CR for his action and just described it as odd. Since you ref, I welcome your input on this. Why was the NASA coach allowed to not only come out on the field but cross the midfield line without any punishment whereas the Concorde coach got a yellow for presumably arguing against the change from yellow to red card for his player? |
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Post by forumguy on Oct 10, 2022 12:09:02 GMT -5
Curious. Didn't these players and parents know what they were getting since they had this coach for a whole year last year? Why not move at tryouts if youre that unhappy? Was this going on last year or just now because they have lost a couple of games?
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Post by NotherSoccerParent on Oct 10, 2022 12:21:10 GMT -5
Curious. Didn't these players and parents know what they were getting since they had this coach for a whole year last year? Why not move at tryouts if youre that unhappy? Was this going on last year or just now because they have lost a couple of games? 🤷🏻♂️Sometimes kids/parents will join or stay on a team bc of their performance the prior year? One of their new players joined simply bc NASA finished first last year but now is having some doubts. The coach has a good reputation in terms of soccer knowledge and tactics so that attracts a lot of players/parents. Just search his name on this forum. However, that doesn’t mean he’s the right coach for everyone. |
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Post by forumguy on Oct 10, 2022 12:50:43 GMT -5
Touche'. Great point Nothersoccerparent.
Probably why we should all do our homework before committing. Sometimes it's not as simple as it being "bad" it's just not the right fit. I'm sure there are a players and families on the team that love and thrive in that environment as much as the ones who don't. To your point about the coaches reputation, different strokes for different folks, I guess.🤷♂️
We have had similar experiences with our oldest son and in hindsight we all came away with great life lessons. Remember to eep everything in perspective it will serve you well
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Post by onekickpop on Oct 10, 2022 13:49:03 GMT -5
Find a coach/program that is convenient to you and makes sense, and offer a program that you feel will help your child to develop. Jumping from program to program just doesn’t make sense in my opinion but to each their own. Does a loss or two indicate that a coach has lost his touch after likely 20-25 years of coaching? Maybe. Is it possible for this coach to turn a program around? Maybe. Are kids still being developed? Maybe. As fans/parents I know how fickle we can be when things don’t go our way, but this is when kids learn the most. The target is on NASA’s back based on their results last year. Everyone is rising to the occasion to try and improve and do better. This is great for the Southeast! Rise above pointing fingers and playing the blame game. The NASA boys have to bounce back after a few red cards and I would not doubt that their coach will work to improve team dynamics.
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Post by perplexed on Oct 10, 2022 14:05:23 GMT -5
Touche'. Great point Nothersoccerparent. Probably why we should all do our homework before committing. Sometimes it's not as simple as it being "bad" it's just not the right fit. I'm sure there are a players and families on the team that love and thrive in that environment as much as the ones who don't. To your point about the coaches reputation, different strokes for different folks, I guess.🤷♂️ We have had similar experiences with our oldest son and in hindsight we all came away with great life lessons. Remember to eep everything in perspective it will serve you well First time poster: I don't think it's just that simple forumguy, coaches make roster decisions, implement strategies and create certain cultures whether they are right or wrong that the boys (and parents) have no control over but yet they are on the hot seat when those decisions do not pan out. Here's my opinion of what has transpired. ( to Nothersoccerparent's points) Roster: We no longer have 2 of our top players. Both boys contributed greatly to our scoring output. So our overall roster did not get better and we aren't scoring as much. If you watch our games we control possession for a lot of the game, but we are not creating as many good chances. Our 'Goals for' are way down. Trap Players: As far as trap players go, yes they helped us late in the Spring Season ( just as other teams also benefited from Trap Players), but we did not lose a game in the Fall Season. So the Trap Player comment is not really that valid in my opinion. Plus we had key players out for 2-3 games in the Spring Season as well. Team Chemistry: Team chemistry is not as good as it was last year that is for sure. You will see our boys pickering at times whereas last year I do not recall seeing that. Obviously winning vs losing creates much of that. Also, one of the boys we lost was a team favorite and I think that may have had more of an impact than one would think. Parent Chemistry: Last season was very good. Many of the parents and boys even spent a week together in Spain and hung out on away trips. I feel like a " brotherhood" was cultivated last season. Coaching: And I do not want to say too much, but the bottom line is, I think the coach is very close to "losing the boys". And it is very unfortunate. There was no reason for a team that won 18 games last year to take a step back whether it is the roster itself, the starting line up, the amount of playing time Coach distributes or the way he motivates the boys, It's the coaches team and just as he was given much of credit for last season's success - the lack of success and turmoil must also be somewhat accredited to him. Lastly, and maybe MOST importantly, the boys need to play better as I think they can, there is a lot of soccer left. |
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Post by atlantasoccerdad2020 on Oct 10, 2022 14:29:52 GMT -5
Yes, the AR on the side where any incident occurs should provide his or her input to the ref. However, in this case, it was the AR on the other half of the field AND other side of the field who came over to the ref, provided his "input," which resulted in changing the yellow card to a red for the Concorde player. In a situation where you have a seasoned ref who is an AR for a game and a relatively new ref, I think it is completely appropriate for the seasoned ref (who is AR) to help or mentor the ref. The ref in this game did not seem "new" and was very decisive in his initial carding; red for NASA player (for pushing the player down and kicking at him) and yellow for Concorde player. Just odd that the AR who had direct sight said nothing and the AR on the opposite side of the action interjected. I wasn’t there but I do referee and you can’t see everything - sometimes even if you’re “right there”. From the fan sideline, you have no idea what they can and cannot see. If your kid got elbowed in the head and the CR and nearest AR couldn’t see it because of sight lines (and sneaky players exploiting those sight lines).. and the other AR did see it.. wouldn’t you want the right call to be made? Here is one for you as you are a ref. 2-3 times this weekend in 2 of the games I attended the AR made a call only an AR can make just for the ref to overturn. Why even have an AR if their pov and calls do not matter. One was a foul on the keeper the other was a blatant offside by the offense on a free kick. |
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Post by forumguy on Oct 10, 2022 15:29:23 GMT -5
Touche'. Great point Nothersoccerparent. Probably why we should all do our homework before committing. Sometimes it's not as simple as it being "bad" it's just not the right fit. I'm sure there are a players and families on the team that love and thrive in that environment as much as the ones who don't. To your point about the coaches reputation, different strokes for different folks, I guess.🤷♂️ We have had similar experiences with our oldest son and in hindsight we all came away with great life lessons. Remember to eep everything in perspective it will serve you well First time poster: I don't think it's just that simple forumguy, coaches make decisions, implement strategies and create certain cultures whether they are right or wrong that the boys (and parents) have no control over but yet they are on the hot seat when those decisions do not pan out. Here's my opinion of what has transpired. ( to Nothersoccerparent's points) Roster: We no longer have 2 of our top players. Both boys contributed greatly to our scoring output. So our overall roster did not get better and we aren't scoring as much. If you watch our games we control possession for a lot of the game, but we are not creating as many good chances. Our 'Goals for' are way down. Trap Players: As far as trap players go, yes they helped us late in the Spring Season ( just as other teams also benefited from Trap Players), but we did not lose a game in the Fall Season. So the Trap Player comment is not really that valid in my opinion. Plus we had key players out for 2-3 games in the Spring Season as well. Team Chemistry: Team chemistry is not as good as it was last year that is for sure. You will see our boys pickering at times whereas last year I do not recall seeing that. Obviously winning vs losing creates much of that. Also, one of the boys we lost was a team favorite and I think that may have had more of an impact than one would think. Parent Chemistry: Last season was very good. Many of the parents and boys even spent a week together in Spain and hung out on away trips. I feel like a " brotherhood" was cultivated last season. Coaching: And I do not want to say too much, but the bottom line is, I think the coach is very close to "losing the boys". And it is very unfortunate. There was no reason for a team that won 18 games last year to take a step back whether it is the roster itself, the starting line up, the amount of playing time Coach distributes or the way he motivates the boys, It's the coaches team and just as he was given much of credit for last season's success - the lack of success and turmoil must also be somewhat accredited to him. Lastly, and maybe MOST importantly, the boys need to play better as I think they can, there is a lot of soccer left. I like Onekickpop's take. A common sense approach. Perplexed, you yourself said there is a lot of soccer still to be played and you are correct this coach does have a stellar reputation. So let's see how this turns out. Can only really make judgement calls at the end of the season and it looks like there is more than half the season still left to play. Has injuries been a factor at all? |
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Post by Keeper on Oct 10, 2022 15:50:51 GMT -5
Respectfully, I think the boys did decide the outcome. Concorde controlled the game and even scored playing with a man down. 3-0 is a decisive win. Not sure what happened but that NASA 08-team is a shell of what I remember from last year. Watch the Veo. Ref dictated the game with numerous home cooking calls from the 2 minute mark. Add in him taking one of NASA’s top players out on a bogus call. Then the CF 2nd goal never should have happened, the GK clearly had two hands on the ball which the AR called but the Ref refused to overturn the goal. Again had the boys been able to play it would have been a game, but the Ref’s ego decided otherwise. NASA 08s have two out with ACLs and on Saturday Premier hacked on a couple others so one starter was nursing a serious injury. |
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Post by Keeper on Oct 10, 2022 15:52:19 GMT -5
Two Concorde and NASA players got tangled up halfway into the 1st half. NASA player gets a red, Concorde player initially gets a yellow. After conferring with the AR on the other half of the field (🤷🏻♂️), ref changes Concorde player’s yellow to straight red. Later in the half, Concorde player gets a second yellow for a foul so half finishes with 10 NASA players, 9 Concorde players. With 5-10 minutes left in the 2nd half, NASA player gets two yellow cards back to back for mouthing off to the ref. Both teams finish with 9 on the field. Concorde 3, NASA 0. pretty typical to ask the AR what s/he saw in a “tangled up” situation. Ref didn’t ask AR2 who was 10 feet from it, only with talking to AR1 who was 50 yards away that he gave the nasa player a straight Red. |
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Post by Keeper on Oct 10, 2022 15:54:28 GMT -5
You are correct. NASA played essentially half the game (if not a little more) with one man up so they certainly had the advantage but could not capitalize. Teams succeed when they treat each other as teammates and play as a team. Kids become better players when they know what they have to improve on. Parents can support their kids when they know what is going on with team. None of this is going on, hence the drastic turnaround from last year. Question: Isn't this the same coach as last year? How are things different if it's the same coach? Is there new players? New parent dynamic? What has changed on this team that they are so different from last year? Same coach, couple new players, 2 returners with ACLs another injured from Premier on Saturday. And about 4 ECRL players called up too |
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Post by cfsc on Oct 10, 2022 16:51:47 GMT -5
Respectfully, I think the boys did decide the outcome. Concorde controlled the game and even scored playing with a man down. 3-0 is a decisive win. Not sure what happened but that NASA 08-team is a shell of what I remember from last year. Watch the Veo. Ref dictated the game with numerous home cooking calls from the 2 minute mark. Add in him taking one of NASA’s top players out on a bogus call. Then the CF 2nd goal never should have happened, the GK clearly had two hands on the ball which the AR called but the Ref refused to overturn the goal. Again had the boys been able to play it would have been a game, but the Ref’s ego decided otherwise. NASA 08s have two out with ACLs and on Saturday Premier hacked on a couple others so one starter was nursing a serious injury. So you are telling me that that the ref who gave 2 red cards to CF and 1 to NASA ( I know there was a second red given to NASA but that was late in the game when the score was 3-0) was home cooking for CF and that is why CF played much of the game down a man. Oh -Please. You mentioned the one goal CF scored with Goalie interference (which I do not want to even get into) but what about the other two? How can you complain when your team plays a man up and doesn't even score. Maybe this is what's going on at NASA... excuses. |
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Post by rifle on Oct 10, 2022 17:32:00 GMT -5
I wasn’t there but I do referee and you can’t see everything - sometimes even if you’re “right there”. From the fan sideline, you have no idea what they can and cannot see. If your kid got elbowed in the head and the CR and nearest AR couldn’t see it because of sight lines (and sneaky players exploiting those sight lines).. and the other AR did see it.. wouldn’t you want the right call to be made? Here is one for you as you are a ref. 2-3 times this weekend in 2 of the games I attended the AR made a call only an AR can make just for the ref to overturn. Why even have an AR if their pov and calls do not matter. One was a foul on the keeper the other was a blatant offside by the offense on a free kick. Refs that get assigned to high level games tend to be pretty good. Often ARs are newer refs - the kind who soon get discouraged by complaining coaches and parents. Rinse and repeat - mix of skill level. What you described sounds weird. I never had a center overturn a call when I was an AR - but I can see it happening. I would be curious to see the video of this game since it appears to have struck some nerves. Offside decisions should be the ARs to make so that sounds unusual that the CR overruled. |
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Post by bogan on Oct 10, 2022 18:33:07 GMT -5
Here is one for you as you are a ref. 2-3 times this weekend in 2 of the games I attended the AR made a call only an AR can make just for the ref to overturn. Why even have an AR if their pov and calls do not matter. One was a foul on the keeper the other was a blatant offside by the offense on a free kick. Refs that get assigned to high level games tend to be pretty good. Often ARs are newer refs - the kind who soon get discouraged by complaining coaches and parents. Rinse and repeat - mix of skill level. What you described sounds weird. I never had a center overturn a call when I was an AR - but I can see it happening. I would be curious to see the video of this game since it appears to have struck some nerves. Offside decisions should be the ARs to make so that sounds unusual that the CR overruled. Sounds like there was a lot of money riding on this game. ECNL-BETS? |
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Post by triffling on Oct 13, 2022 15:08:55 GMT -5
First of all, Center referees oftern overrule ARs - especially if their position gives them a better view of what happened.
Also, Centers waive off offside when they have information that the AR doesn’t have such as a ball being played by a defender or doubt about whether an attacker being flagged for offside was involved in the play.
And there are also plenty of times when an AR who has the best view gets improperly overruled or ignored or simply knows not to raise their flag because the ref in the center either won’t call it or to call it would create other problems for the referee. The role of the AR is to ASSIST the referee, not to call the game from the touch. I’ve worked plenty of games with less experienced or poor referees and it can be frustrating, but sometimes you just have to let them do a poor job.
As for this game, absent seeing video I have nothing to say other than a decent referee should be able to get through a U14 ECNL game with 22 players still on the pitch and minimal cautions. If you’ve got two 2nd caution reds and 2 direct reds, you have failed to effectively manage a match.
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Post by soccerloafer on Oct 13, 2022 20:06:51 GMT -5
First of all, Center referees oftern overrule ARs - especially if their position gives them a better view of what happened. Also, Centers waive off offside when they have information that the AR doesn’t have such as a ball being played by a defender or doubt about whether an attacker being flagged for offside was involved in the play. And there are also plenty of times when an AR who has the best view gets improperly overruled or ignored or simply knows not to raise their flag because the ref in the center either won’t call it or to call it would create other problems for the referee. The role of the AR is to ASSIST the referee, not to call the game from the touch. I’ve worked plenty of games with less experienced or poor referees and it can be frustrating, but sometimes you just have to let them do a poor job. As for this game, absent seeing video I have nothing to say other than a decent referee should be able to get through a U14 ECNL game with 22 players still on the pitch and minimal cautions. If you’ve got two 2nd caution reds and 2 direct reds, you have failed to effectively manage a match. The back to back yellows for dissent on the same player (making a red) show immaturity by the referee. As a parent who has raised three kids through the teen years, I've learned that kids don't shut up right away, particularly when upset or challenged. Give the yellow and move away. Venting will continue, but unless profanity or personal attacks follow, let it go and get the game moving. I had one incident in a HS game years ago. Cautioned a player (don't remember why) and he immediately told me to do something anatomically impossible (heard by everyone within 20 yards). Quickly switched to red. Coach told me the player would never use that language and I must be crazy... Barring that level of direct attack, move on... |
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Post by soccerloafer on Oct 14, 2022 11:36:06 GMT -5
First of all, Center referees oftern overrule ARs - especially if their position gives them a better view of what happened. Also, Centers waive off offside when they have information that the AR doesn’t have such as a ball being played by a defender or doubt about whether an attacker being flagged for offside was involved in the play. And there are also plenty of times when an AR who has the best view gets improperly overruled or ignored or simply knows not to raise their flag because the ref in the center either won’t call it or to call it would create other problems for the referee. The role of the AR is to ASSIST the referee, not to call the game from the touch. I’ve worked plenty of games with less experienced or poor referees and it can be frustrating, but sometimes you just have to let them do a poor job. As for this game, absent seeing video I have nothing to say other than a decent referee should be able to get through a U14 ECNL game with 22 players still on the pitch and minimal cautions. If you’ve got two 2nd caution reds and 2 direct reds, you have failed to effectively manage a match. "As for this game, absent seeing video I have nothing to say other than a decent referee should be able to get through a U14 ECNL game with 22 players still on the pitch and minimal cautions. If you’ve got two 2nd caution reds and 2 direct reds, you have failed to effectively manage a match." Not picking on you, but every now and then that one player shows up and doesn't want to play. Nothing we can do as referees can keep them from a red. Not often, but it happens, and you know it in the first five minutes and nothing you do or say can stop it... |
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