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Post by oraclesfriend on Oct 16, 2024 8:54:09 GMT -5
So. May, 2013 is currently U12 2025/26 she will be U13 Under new old rule what will be age group? As I understand what's being rumored, nothing will change for her. May is right in the middle of the school grade age. Assuming she's in 6th grade currently, she would play with her 7th grade classmates next year. It's the kids born after the school cutoff (Aug 31?) that will be "moved down" to play with their classmates who will be entering 6th grade next year, in your example. So her team will potentially lose a couple of 2013 kids but potentially gain a couple of 2012 kids with late birthdays. But who knows if this is going to happen. According to the letter we received from our club’s league the vote is happening November 22. The date range would return to the stupid Aug 1- July 31. Not sure why they keep doing that as that continues to put a small group of kids always with the wrong grade level in almost every state as very few states use that date range. Two states (Vermont and Connecticut) will go back to having gap year kids from not having them as they use January 1 as their school cut off for kindergarten. Some states like New Jersey, Louisiana and Maine have school year cut offs into October 1 or 15 so it won’t change things much as just shift them. There are several that have Sept 30 but I did not put those all into memory (that would mean 1/6th of kids with the wrong birth year instead of the current 1/4th in some other states). Honestly I am curious if they actually did run a population analysis with the states with the highest output of players because some states (like New Jersey) that would not really change for the better that put out a large number of very strong players I wonder what those federations said??? Personally I am of the opinion if they change the dates they should just change it to permit it based on grade level only and do it based on the state federation having to grant permission to play in a certain graduation year based upon your birth date. That should have to line up with whatever your state policy is for the kindergarten entry. So if in NJ in is October 1 then so be it! And if it Connecticut it is January 1 then fine. Those three months won’t matter by high school ages in their growth patterns when they are playing interstate travel and when they play out of state as littles then the home state has to accept the visitors policy prior to accepting them into the tournament and after that no arguments. You have seen the BC and that is that. |
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Post by redydc on Oct 16, 2024 8:56:30 GMT -5
According to this piece, “US Soccer is currently contemplating a significant change to the birth year registration system, potentially shifting back to the August 1–July 31 format. This decision has been under discussion for much of the year, and a final vote is expected to take place on November 22, 2024.” dpleague.org/birth-year/This article is from a DPL site, but it’s the first I’ve seen that has shared a specific date. If it moves forward as outlined above, I’d assume August birthdays would have the option to play up and stay with their current team. |
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atlnoleg
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Post by atlnoleg on Oct 16, 2024 9:53:08 GMT -5
According to this piece, “US Soccer is currently contemplating a significant change to the birth year registration system, potentially shifting back to the August 1–July 31 format. This decision has been under discussion for much of the year, and a final vote is expected to take place on November 22, 2024.” dpleague.org/birth-year/This article is from a DPL site, but it’s the first I’ve seen that has shared a specific date. If it moves forward as outlined above, I’d assume August birthdays would have the option to play up and stay with their current team. I would think they'd make exceptions for August birthdays since the majority of the country uses Sept.1 as the cut off. We'll see I guess. |
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Post by mamadona on Oct 19, 2024 19:30:52 GMT -5
I'm kinda excited about it, if it happens. A little mix up of players on teams might not be a bad thing. Teams should be slightly stronger overall as they will lose their youngest players and gain some that are up to 5 months older than the current oldest ones.
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Post by soccernoleuk on Oct 20, 2024 7:15:07 GMT -5
Since almost all kids playing soccer have an aspiration to go play in college, and those that advance from Youth Club end up there as opposed to going pro directly, they should just make it based on graduation year. That would not only keep kids playing with peers they go to school with, but it would also make it a lot easier on college coaches to recruit. (Oh, this is a 2028 grad year team, they then know every kid on the field graduates in 2028, and don't have to guess).
It's the same with College ID Camps held by clubs. Why do they always separate kids by birth year for the college coaches? They don't care when the kids were born, just when they are graduating.
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Post by oraclesfriend on Oct 20, 2024 9:20:10 GMT -5
I'm kinda excited about it, if it happens. A little mix up of players on teams might not be a bad thing. Teams should be slightly stronger overall as they will lose their youngest players and gain some that are up to 5 months older than the current oldest ones. Teams won’t be stronger or weaker “overall” as it will depend on what team your perspective is coming from. You are looking at it from the perspective of someone whose child is going to stay in the same age group (as mine will) but if your child is on the younger side then their team will be “weaker” as it will be younger. That is provided they stay at the same club and level. My experience from going through this with my older child is that it became a giant sh**show with smaller and midsize clubs and teams. Lots of players leave for bigger clubs when their teams gets broken up. It probably won’t happen as much at the high school ages as many of them know each other anyway. There it is more about the best opportunities. |
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atlnoleg
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Post by atlnoleg on Oct 21, 2024 7:34:03 GMT -5
I was talking about it with my boys the other day. They are not impacted by the dates, but they were only considering the younger kids they'd be losing. They didn't think it made a difference for them until I pointed out that they will be competing at tryouts next year with the year above kids who are in their grade. It got a little quiet after that.
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Post by playfromtheback on Oct 21, 2024 7:57:46 GMT -5
While this may not be the best for everyone I think it is best for the game. It gets rid of trapped players for the most part. Yes, you may still have a handful of kids who were held back for whatever reason that would be a trapped u15. That however would be the exception and not the rule. Based off the 9/1 cutoff date in Georgia about 1/3 of the kids don't have a place to play competitive spring soccer as U15's. They also then have to fit in with a new team their senior year of high school. Someone before had noted the different cut offs that states have that are after 8/1 so it will not be a perfect grade level match. To me there is a huge difference between that and trapped players. My son is a u13, and he has someone on his team with an August birthday who is a 7th grader. with the 8/1 cut off, the way I understand it, he would be able to play next year as an 8th grader with boys that are mostly in 7th grade. However, he would have the choice if he wanted to play up to play with his grade, and he would never have a "lost season".
I'm not worried about the fraction of a percent of the kids who go to play for youth national teams. That can still be kept by birth year to stay with the rest of the world for international competition.
This is just fixing a problem that was created when we switched to birth year. There may be bumps in the road for a year but that doesn't mean it shouldn't be fixed for the greater good.
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Post by bolo on Oct 21, 2024 15:01:27 GMT -5
Since almost all kids playing soccer have an aspiration to go play in college... If you really think this, I've got some news for you- they don't! Maybe you mean kids on ECNL or MLS Next teams- especially higher level teams. Or maybe you mean the 10-year-olds whose parents think they're really good so they will definitely still be really good when they're juniors in high school. But the vast majority of kids playing soccer- most of which are NOT playing ECNL or MLS Next, by the way- have little illusion that they're going to continue playing in college, or even want to. My kid is on a higher-level 06/07 ECNL-R team with one of the big clubs in town and literally 1-2 kids out of the 23 on their roster are even considering playing in college. And these are kids that aren't D-1 prospects, but could definitely play at mid-level and below schools if they wanted to. But all of them are well-rounded kids that realize there's more to life than soccer, so they want to go to the college they actually would want to attend without soccer, have a normal social life, and maybe play intramural or club if they really want to keep playing. But to think these kids are the exception rather than the rule, as you implied above, is pretty naïve. |
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Post by playfromtheback on Oct 21, 2024 15:24:17 GMT -5
Since almost all kids playing soccer have an aspiration to go play in college... If you really think this, I've got some news for you- they don't! Maybe you mean kids on ECNL or MLS Next teams- especially higher level teams. Or maybe you mean the 10-year-olds whose parents think they're really good so they will definitely still be really good when they're juniors in high school. But the vast majority of kids playing soccer- most of which are NOT playing ECNL or MLS Next, by the way- have little illusion that they're going to continue playing in college, or even want to. My kid is on a higher-level 06/07 ECNL-R team with one of the big clubs in town and literally 1-2 kids out of the 23 on their roster are even considering playing in college. And these are kids that aren't D-1 prospects, but could definitely play at mid-level and below schools if they wanted to. But all of them are well-rounded kids that realize there's more to life than soccer, so they want to go to the college they actually would want to attend without soccer, have a normal social life, and maybe play intramural or club if they really want to keep playing. But to think these kids are the exception rather than the rule, as you implied above, is pretty naïve. I find it funny how in the past week or two I have been asked by three people if my son wants to play in college. My answer was... he is 12 and in 6th grade (he would be a trapped u15) who knows what he will want to do. He may not even play high school soccer (he would most likely keep playing club) because he may choose to try to go to a high school in our county with some great academic track programs that aren't available at most schools and that school doesn't have athletics. I would encourage this because we understand what soccer is and we nor he has no delusions of making a career out of soccer. |
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Post by soccernoleuk on Oct 22, 2024 7:21:38 GMT -5
Since almost all kids playing soccer have an aspiration to go play in college... If you really think this, I've got some news for you- they don't! Maybe you mean kids on ECNL or MLS Next teams- especially higher level teams. Or maybe you mean the 10-year-olds whose parents think they're really good so they will definitely still be really good when they're juniors in high school. But the vast majority of kids playing soccer- most of which are NOT playing ECNL or MLS Next, by the way- have little illusion that they're going to continue playing in college, or even want to. My kid is on a higher-level 06/07 ECNL-R team with one of the big clubs in town and literally 1-2 kids out of the 23 on their roster are even considering playing in college. And these are kids that aren't D-1 prospects, but could definitely play at mid-level and below schools if they wanted to. But all of them are well-rounded kids that realize there's more to life than soccer, so they want to go to the college they actually would want to attend without soccer, have a normal social life, and maybe play intramural or club if they really want to keep playing. But to think these kids are the exception rather than the rule, as you implied above, is pretty naïve. Might be the difference between boys & girls. My daughter plays on an 06/07 RL team and the entire team is trying to get offers to play in college...more than half the team already has offers. Her old team, at a different club is the same way. We also know people on the E64 teams at both clubs and there are girls on both of those teams looking for offers. At our high school, if you include the Class of 2025, we will have graduated about 25 varsity girls over the past 4 years. Of those, I believe about 80% are going on to play in college. So, on the boys side you might be right, but on the girls side there are a lot of kids looking to continue playing in college. |
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Post by playfromtheback on Oct 22, 2024 8:39:36 GMT -5
If you really think this, I've got some news for you- they don't! Maybe you mean kids on ECNL or MLS Next teams- especially higher level teams. Or maybe you mean the 10-year-olds whose parents think they're really good so they will definitely still be really good when they're juniors in high school. But the vast majority of kids playing soccer- most of which are NOT playing ECNL or MLS Next, by the way- have little illusion that they're going to continue playing in college, or even want to. My kid is on a higher-level 06/07 ECNL-R team with one of the big clubs in town and literally 1-2 kids out of the 23 on their roster are even considering playing in college. And these are kids that aren't D-1 prospects, but could definitely play at mid-level and below schools if they wanted to. But all of them are well-rounded kids that realize there's more to life than soccer, so they want to go to the college they actually would want to attend without soccer, have a normal social life, and maybe play intramural or club if they really want to keep playing. But to think these kids are the exception rather than the rule, as you implied above, is pretty naïve. Might be the difference between boys & girls. My daughter plays on an 06/07 RL team and the entire team is trying to get offers to play in college...more than half the team already has offers. Her old team, at a different club is the same way. We also know people on the E64 teams at both clubs and there are girls on both of those teams looking for offers. At our high school, if you include the Class of 2025, we will have graduated about 25 varsity girls over the past 4 years. Of those, I believe about 80% are going on to play in college. So, on the boys side you might be right, but on the girls side there are a lot of kids looking to continue playing in college. That is great that a majority of your daughter's team is looking to play in college. However, I think you proved bolo's point. You said your daughter is on an ECNL RL team. When I look at my son's club (one of the big 5) they have 10 2012 boys teams at our location. Only 20% of the kids are playing ECNL/ECNL RL. When you add in the rec program there are another 9 teams worth of 2012 boys (18 U13/14 combined teams) so we are really talking about just over 10% of players. This is also just looking at the main campus where the ECNL/ECNL RL teams are based. There are many clubs that don't have teams in these leagues, plus many satellite locations. This is just a guess, but my guess is less than 5% (probably closer to 2-3% of kids) are playing ECNL/ECNL RL/MLS Next/GA |
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Post by bolo on Oct 22, 2024 9:26:00 GMT -5
If you really think this, I've got some news for you- they don't! Maybe you mean kids on ECNL or MLS Next teams- especially higher level teams. Or maybe you mean the 10-year-olds whose parents think they're really good so they will definitely still be really good when they're juniors in high school. But the vast majority of kids playing soccer- most of which are NOT playing ECNL or MLS Next, by the way- have little illusion that they're going to continue playing in college, or even want to. My kid is on a higher-level 06/07 ECNL-R team with one of the big clubs in town and literally 1-2 kids out of the 23 on their roster are even considering playing in college. And these are kids that aren't D-1 prospects, but could definitely play at mid-level and below schools if they wanted to. But all of them are well-rounded kids that realize there's more to life than soccer, so they want to go to the college they actually would want to attend without soccer, have a normal social life, and maybe play intramural or club if they really want to keep playing. But to think these kids are the exception rather than the rule, as you implied above, is pretty naïve. Might be the difference between boys & girls. My daughter plays on an 06/07 RL team and the entire team is trying to get offers to play in college...more than half the team already has offers. Her old team, at a different club is the same way. We also know people on the E64 teams at both clubs and there are girls on both of those teams looking for offers. At our high school, if you include the Class of 2025, we will have graduated about 25 varsity girls over the past 4 years. Of those, I believe about 80% are going on to play in college. So, on the boys side you might be right, but on the girls side there are a lot of kids looking to continue playing in college. I'm talking about the girls side as well, FYI. And that's great for your team that they all want to play in college. It definitely varies from club-to-club and team-to-team. Some clubs emphasize and even push it more for their players, others don't. Ours hasn't at all. The reality is girls at the level our daughters are playing probably aren't looking at offers from SEC or ACC-type schools, which is where the majority of the girls on our team want to go to college. So they'd rather choose their college destination based on academics, social life, preferred major, school size & location, etc., as opposed to if they get a little bit of scholarship money to play at a smaller school that they otherwise wouldn't be interested in. But some kids would rather go to those lower-tier soccer schools if it means they can keep playing, and that's great for them. Every kid & every family is different in what they want. But my hope for any kid would be that they choose a school that they would be happy attending for four years even without soccer, because the reality is many of them will likely at least consider stopping playing at some point during college for a variety of reasons. I was friends with two girls at UGA back in the '90's that played soccer as freshmen, but dropped it after a year because they decided they would rather be "regular college students" with normal social lives. And I would say that happens a decent bit. |
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Post by Soccerhouse on Oct 22, 2024 10:26:21 GMT -5
Its really hard also for good high quality students that have opportunity to go to UGA for free or relatively inexpensive vs other options.
The difference between boys and girls couldn't be more dramatic -- from the age of recruitment, to the vast amount of opportunities available at major schools.
I've known and seen boys that are incredible talents (yea, my opinion) can't get a sniff from a D1 school, only offers are small d3 schools with < 2,000 kids. Its a very difficult path to on the boy side for non MLS Academy kids since DA folded. (I'm not saying there is anything wrong with smaller d2/d3 programs - but go to a major ACC/SEC/Big 10 school and it's pretty incredible)
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Post by Soccerhouse on Oct 23, 2024 11:37:25 GMT -5
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Post by blueokra14 on Oct 23, 2024 11:51:54 GMT -5
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Post by terimakasih12 on Oct 23, 2024 21:12:33 GMT -5
This has been an interesting development to watch unfold. I anticipate the vote will be unanimous to go from birth year to Aug 1 - July 31. Time will tell. My only question right now is whether kids with an August or September birthday can go up to the next age bracket in Fall 2025. If not, my kid's current team is going to look very different next year. I expect this will be the case in many places. |
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Post by newguy on Oct 24, 2024 8:08:27 GMT -5
This has been an interesting development to watch unfold. I anticipate the vote will be unanimous to go from birth year to Aug 1 - July 31. Time will tell. My only question right now is whether kids with an August or September birthday can go up to the next age bracket in Fall 2025. If not, my kid's current team is going to look very different next year. I expect this will be the case in many places. My guess is 10%-20% of every team out there will have kids that can “repeat” their current age group which should make for interesting tryouts…if coaches actually care. |
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Post by playfromtheback on Oct 24, 2024 8:11:00 GMT -5
This has been an interesting development to watch unfold. I anticipate the vote will be unanimous to go from birth year to Aug 1 - July 31. Time will tell. My only question right now is whether kids with an August or September birthday can go up to the next age bracket in Fall 2025. If not, my kid's current team is going to look very different next year. I expect this will be the case in many places. Unless I am missing something, this is what I like about this change. It gives kids a choice to play up and play with their grade. My son is a trapped 2012 6th graded (Sept birthday) and right now he can not play with 66% of the kids in his grade. One of his current teammates is an August birthday but a 7th grader. My understanding of what is proposed is if this child wanted to, he could play up (as you can always play up but never play down) to play with 8th graders next year. I think the question is what will clubs allow vs what the rule will allow. |
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Post by redydc on Oct 24, 2024 8:54:51 GMT -5
This has been an interesting development to watch unfold. I anticipate the vote will be unanimous to go from birth year to Aug 1 - July 31. Time will tell. My only question right now is whether kids with an August or September birthday can go up to the next age bracket in Fall 2025. If not, my kid's current team is going to look very different next year. I expect this will be the case in many places. My guess is 10%-20% of every team out there will have kids that can “repeat” their current age group which should make for interesting tryouts…if coaches actually care. It’s a small sample size, but our club asked team managers to highlight player graduation years in a spreadsheet. For the U15 and U14 teams, roughly five players per team would repeat their current age group. |
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Post by mamadona on Oct 24, 2024 10:02:04 GMT -5
Why Aug 1 cut off and not Sep 1? Do other states have Aug 1 as their school cut off?
Yes I assume a lot off Aug birthdays would play up to be with their grade, unless they're held back at school which quite a few boys especially are.
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Post by playfromtheback on Oct 24, 2024 10:15:09 GMT -5
Why Aug 1 cut off and not Sep 1? Do other states have Aug 1 as their school cut off? Yes I assume a lot off Aug birthdays would play up to be with their grade, unless they're held back at school which quite a few boys especially are. Yes, there are a handful of states. Plus, other states leave it up to each district to determine their cutoff. Here is something that I found that is helpful: www.ecs.org/clearinghouse/78/60/7860.pdf |
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Post by newguy on Oct 24, 2024 10:19:01 GMT -5
My guess is 10%-20% of every team out there will have kids that can “repeat” their current age group which should make for interesting tryouts…if coaches actually care. It’s a small sample size, but our club asked team managers to highlight player graduation years in a spreadsheet. For the U15 and U14 teams, roughly five players per team would repeat their current age group. Interesting and thanks for the info. ID camps are going to get wild this Spring. |
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Post by mamadona on Oct 24, 2024 10:25:32 GMT -5
It’s a small sample size, but our club asked team managers to highlight player graduation years in a spreadsheet. For the U15 and U14 teams, roughly five players per team would repeat their current age group. Interesting and thanks for the info. ID camps are going to get wild this Spring. Ok thanks. It seems kinda dumb to make it Aug 1 when 35+ states have Sep 1 or later. But maybe it is because quite a few are held back. So maybe making it Sep 1 would mean more trapped players. |
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Post by rookiemom on Oct 24, 2024 11:25:10 GMT -5
This has been an interesting development to watch unfold. I anticipate the vote will be unanimous to go from birth year to Aug 1 - July 31. Time will tell. My only question right now is whether kids with an August or September birthday can go up to the next age bracket in Fall 2025. If not, my kid's current team is going to look very different next year. I expect this will be the case in many places. My guess is 10%-20% of every team out there will have kids that can “repeat” their current age group which should make for interesting tryouts…if coaches actually care. I just looked at my daughter's U14 (2011s) roster and 40% would be eligible to "repeat" including my daughter. The change would certainly keep her from being trapped next school year when over half the team is in high school. We are on a lower level team though. I wonder if the percentage would decrease as you look up the hierarchy, the idea being that you have more older girls on the higher level teams. Would be interesting to see the numbers breakdown. (at least to someone like me who loves a spreadsheet!) |
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Post by mamadona on Oct 24, 2024 11:49:02 GMT -5
My guess is 10%-20% of every team out there will have kids that can “repeat” their current age group which should make for interesting tryouts…if coaches actually care. I just looked at my daughter's U14 (2011s) roster and 40% would be eligible to "repeat" including my daughter. The change would certainly keep her from being trapped next school year when over half the team is in high school. We are on a lower level team though. I wonder if the percentage would decrease as you look up the hierarchy, the idea being that you have more older girls on the higher level teams. Would be interesting to see the numbers breakdown. (at least to someone like me who loves a spreadsheet!) Lol! I like spreadsheets too. On all the teams my daughter has been on (mid level teams) there has always been a large majority spring birthdays. On her current team, 1/3 would move down. |
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gob31
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Post by gob31 on Oct 24, 2024 15:55:41 GMT -5
My guess is 10%-20% of every team out there will have kids that can “repeat” their current age group which should make for interesting tryouts…if coaches actually care. I just looked at my daughter's U14 (2011s) roster and 40% would be eligible to "repeat" including my daughter. The change would certainly keep her from being trapped next school year when over half the team is in high school. We are on a lower level team though. I wonder if the percentage would decrease as you look up the hierarchy, the idea being that you have more older girls on the higher level teams. Would be interesting to see the numbers breakdown. (at least to someone like me who loves a spreadsheet!) Broadly speaking, the higher you go up the ladder of teams in an age bracket, you’ll see fewer late-year birthdays, especially at the academy level. Obviously this can change team by team, but generally that’s the way it works because older kids tend to be faster and stronger sooner. |
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Post by slickdaddy96 on Oct 25, 2024 12:30:33 GMT -5
As I said before in this post. No matter where you put the age brackets some group of kids are going to get screwed from it. Right now Early month birthday kids get an advantage to be on higher level teams. If they change it back, it will just benefit the August and later birthdate kids and screw over the ones currently getting the benefit. Either way some kid is getting messed over.
At this point honestly they should just leave it be, and if higher level leagues want to change it for them only let them do it, and either way they need to do it better than they did it last time. They need to grandfather people in that are say U13 and over playing 11v11 already, and only start this for the Academy age kids and lower. Then the next year it will be U14 and above is grandfathered in and so on and so forth until all 11v11 age groups are with whatever new standard they want to enact. That way you don't mess over folks again that have already lived through one set of age changes already.
I'm so glad my son has aged out, and my daughter only plays recreation if that after this season. As a referee this won't affect me at all, so I won't give a crap once all my kids quit playing or age out.
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Post by playfromtheback on Oct 28, 2024 11:59:13 GMT -5
As I said before in this post. No matter where you put the age brackets some group of kids are going to get screwed from it. Right now Early month birthday kids get an advantage to be on higher level teams. If they change it back, it will just benefit the August and later birthdate kids and screw over the ones currently getting the benefit. Either way some kid is getting messed over. At this point honestly they should just leave it be, and if higher level leagues want to change it for them only let them do it, and either way they need to do it better than they did it last time. They need to grandfather people in that are say U13 and over playing 11v11 already, and only start this for the Academy age kids and lower. Then the next year it will be U14 and above is grandfathered in and so on and so forth until all 11v11 age groups are with whatever new standard they want to enact. That way you don't mess over folks again that have already lived through one set of age changes already. I'm so glad my son has aged out, and my daughter only plays recreation if that after this season. As a referee this won't affect me at all, so I won't give a crap once all my kids quit playing or age out. While I hear what you are saying I disagree with you. I think someone would getting screwed. Yes some teams will be mixed up some but I don't think that entails being screwed. You are never entitled to a spot on a team year over year. I think the change to birth year actually screwed people by trapping players. If they want to grandfather people, I hope they do it for those who have already started high school but not go back further. |
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Post by Soccerhouse on Oct 28, 2024 12:14:40 GMT -5
I'm assuming older age group would remain a catch all age group vs creating a separate u19 group right?
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