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Post by oldgasoccer on May 22, 2020 22:02:40 GMT -5
Rumors are flying about the 07 Girls abandoning ship and heading for ECNL programs. Is it happening at other age groups? Without ECNL can Tophat recruit the Top talent? Will Tophat promote from within? Are those girls from 2nd and 3rd teams that could supposedly beat most clubs 1st teams really that talented? Or will Tophat go for other clubs 1st team leftovers? Is Tophat planning just for what is best for next year or what is best for the club in 5-10 years? Stay tuned and find out in the next exciting episode of "As the Tophat World Turns."
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Post by soccerlegacy on May 22, 2020 22:50:02 GMT -5
Rumors are flying about the 07 Girls abandoning ship and heading for ECNL programs. Is it happening at other age groups? Without ECNL can Tophat recruit the Top talent? Will Tophat promote from within? Are those girls from 2nd and 3rd teams that could supposedly beat most clubs 1st teams really that talented? Or will Tophat go for other clubs 1st team leftovers? Is Tophat planning just for what is best for next year or what is best for the club in 5-10 years? Stay tuned and find out in the next exciting episode of "As the Tophat World Turns." Sounds like Tophat are becoming just another club, if this is true. I don't take anything away from what they built over the years. They have been consistent, dominating, and play a pretty brand of soccer. It also helped that because of this, and offering the top level of soccer, the best players flocked to them as arguably "THE" premier club in Atlanta. So they took that top talent and created depth and success in all age groups. However, now that the ECNL carrot is no longer dangling there, people are going to look to other options for their kids. Can Tophat keep their status at the top? My guess... is they will still produce solid teams with their playing style and coaching.. but it will not become "THE" destination club anymore. Even with the loss of top talent they will still be competitive, but ultimately, no longer dominant. Unless, somehow, GA turns out to be an unforeseeable ultra success... they will become many players 2nd or 3rd choice. They will also, no longer, be able to treat players like numbers and actually cater to their players. This could be a good thing for girls that stay... I have heard too many stories of them causally ignoring, dropping, or switching to the next best thing without a care for the player. Maybe by focusing on now having to work to keep a player, they will find some of that missing compassion I have heard is sometimes lacking. |
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Post by baller84 on May 23, 2020 8:56:11 GMT -5
Shame on ECNL for creating this environment and TH's competitors licking their chops. Anyone cares about the players? It's a disgrace.
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Post by newposter on May 23, 2020 11:49:50 GMT -5
I doubt TH cared when they were DA and dissing ECNL.
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Post by baller84 on May 23, 2020 12:23:25 GMT -5
I doubt TH cared when they were DA and dissing ECNL. Probably not then, but they did care during the years they were applying and kept getting rejected over and over, for "valid soccer reasons" I'm sure ... |
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Post by mightydawg on May 23, 2020 13:03:07 GMT -5
At least 7 tophat DA 07 girls have already signed with Concorde.
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Post by baller84 on May 23, 2020 13:17:36 GMT -5
At least 7 tophat DA 07 girls have already signed with Concorde. in other words the closest ECNL club. |
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Post by fanatic21 on May 23, 2020 14:55:57 GMT -5
Shame on ECNL for creating this environment and TH's competitors licking their chops. Anyone cares about the players? It's a disgrace. While I agree that based on reputation, merit, club quality, etc. Tophat should get ECNL, I don't think ECNL's reasoning for leaving them out is limited solely to spite. Probably somewhat based on spite, but also based on the fact adding an additional team would leave one team, either an Atlanta team or Alabama, without a travel partner. ECNL likely doesn't want to do that to the clubs that remained loyal to them. I did say the same thing as you did though when I heard that TH wasn't going to get ECNL. Wouldn't it be nice if all US Soccer organizations, clubs, etc. really cared about what was best for players and player development? |
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Post by baller84 on May 23, 2020 16:32:03 GMT -5
Shame on ECNL for creating this environment and TH's competitors licking their chops. Anyone cares about the players? It's a disgrace. While I agree that based on reputation, merit, club quality, etc. Tophat should get ECNL, I don't think ECNL's reasoning for leaving them out is limited solely to spite. Probably somewhat based on spite, but also based on the fact adding an additional team would leave one team, either an Atlanta team or Alabama, without a travel partner. ECNL likely doesn't want to do that to the clubs that remained loyal to them. I did say the same thing as you did though when I heard that TH wasn't going to get ECNL. Wouldn't it be nice if all US Soccer organizations, clubs, etc. really cared about what was best for players and player development? MLS cares about player development because that's how success is measured in the pros. See my past post. And why travel to begin with when you can have enough 6 solid clubs in Georgia? The unjust instability and stress this has caused to so many on top of the pandemic is ridiculous. It's not ok for NTH (that was competing just fine in ECNL with its 2nd team) to have ECNL or maybe a Georgia club outside metro Atlanta, yet is perfectly ok for CF to have 2. But that was ECNL's way to gain the upper hand on USDA. And what's funny is CF turned around and used that 2nd ECNL spot as leverage with ... SSA whose players and staff play ECNL using CF name and uniforms for two years now. Unbelievable yet as real as it gets. |
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Post by cobbsoccerm on May 23, 2020 16:49:13 GMT -5
Meanwhile, SSA is busy dropping its players like flies and steadily offering TH girls spots sight unseen.
Exactly what it did last year to the boys in order to gobble up players caught up in the NTH/Smyrna acquisition.
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Post by soccerlegacy on May 23, 2020 17:12:31 GMT -5
While I agree that based on reputation, merit, club quality, etc. Tophat should get ECNL, I don't think ECNL's reasoning for leaving them out is limited solely to spite. Probably somewhat based on spite, but also based on the fact adding an additional team would leave one team, either an Atlanta team or Alabama, without a travel partner. ECNL likely doesn't want to do that to the clubs that remained loyal to them. I did say the same thing as you did though when I heard that TH wasn't going to get ECNL. Wouldn't it be nice if all US Soccer organizations, clubs, etc. really cared about what was best for players and player development? MLS cares about player development because that's how success is measured in the pros. See my past post. And why travel to begin with when you can have enough 6 solid clubs in Georgia? The unjust instability and stress this has caused to so many on top of the pandemic is ridiculous. It's not ok for NTH (that was competing just fine in ECNL with its 2nd team) to have ECNL or maybe a Georgia club outside metro Atlanta, yet is perfectly ok for CF to have 2. But that was ECNL's way to gain the upper hand on USDA. And what's funny is CF turned around and used that 2nd ECNL spot as leverage with ... SSA whose players and staff play ECNL using CF name and uniforms for two years now. Unbelievable yet as real as it gets. Actually for what I understand, it was because of the responsibility of holding two teams in ECNL that caused CF to look for a partner and make sure they kept both teams at a high level. So I wouldn't say it was as much leverage as it was offering a a partnership to another club that could provide another step up and developing competitive teams in both slots. It was planned as a win-win for both clubs. Not quite a devious as you make it seem. I agree, the players got screwed and this is what it should all be about... the players. But NTH leadership can only look in the mirror as to where to lay the blame. It shouldn't be at CF for having 2 teams and it shouldn't be on ECNL for shunning a club that shunned them... twice from what I understand. |
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Post by fanatic21 on May 23, 2020 17:18:22 GMT -5
Situations like this are the reason why I don't like entitlement leagues in general. I think every club, team, etc. should be on the same playing field like they were 15 years ago. Every team in every age had an opportunity to earn its way to the highest level. Some may argue that this promotes a win at all cost attitude from coaches and clubs, but most of them have that attitude anyway, despite what they tell you or what their club philosophy is. It's not just Tophat that is locked out of self christened elite leagues - there are lots of clubs looking in from the outside.
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Post by baller84 on May 23, 2020 18:03:11 GMT -5
MLS cares about player development because that's how success is measured in the pros. See my past post. And why travel to begin with when you can have enough 6 solid clubs in Georgia? The unjust instability and stress this has caused to so many on top of the pandemic is ridiculous. It's not ok for NTH (that was competing just fine in ECNL with its 2nd team) to have ECNL or maybe a Georgia club outside metro Atlanta, yet is perfectly ok for CF to have 2. But that was ECNL's way to gain the upper hand on USDA. And what's funny is CF turned around and used that 2nd ECNL spot as leverage with ... SSA whose players and staff play ECNL using CF name and uniforms for two years now. Unbelievable yet as real as it gets. Actually for what I understand, it was because of the responsibility of holding two teams in ECNL that caused CF to look for a partner and make sure they kept both teams at a high level. So I wouldn't say it was as much leverage as it was offering a a partnership to another club that could provide another step up and developing competitive teams in both slots. It was planned as a win-win for both clubs. Not quite a devious as you make it seem. I agree, the players got screwed and this is what it should all be about... the players. But NTH leadership can only look in the mirror as to where to lay the blame. It shouldn't be at CF for having 2 teams and it shouldn't be on ECNL for shunning a club that shunned them... twice from what I understand. To your point on responsibility of holding two teams in ECNL then, how else can you justify awarding CF a 2nd ECNL spot and not give one to SSA or another Georgia club? How is that good for game? Second, TH kept applying for years to ECNL before all that, so not sure who shunned whom first. Most importantly, agree that unfortunately the players paid the price and that's what bothers me the most. |
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Post by baller84 on May 23, 2020 18:04:57 GMT -5
Situations like this are the reason why I don't like entitlement leagues in general. I think every club, team, etc. should be on the same playing field like they were 15 years ago. Every team in every age had an opportunity to earn its way to the highest level. Some may argue that this promotes a win at all cost attitude from coaches and clubs, but most of them have that attitude anyway, despite what they tell you or what their club philosophy is. It's not just Tophat that is locked out of self christened elite leagues - there are lots of clubs looking in from the outside. Spot on bro. |
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Post by baller84 on May 23, 2020 18:18:20 GMT -5
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Post by soccerlegacy on May 23, 2020 22:22:18 GMT -5
Actually for what I understand, it was because of the responsibility of holding two teams in ECNL that caused CF to look for a partner and make sure they kept both teams at a high level. So I wouldn't say it was as much leverage as it was offering a a partnership to another club that could provide another step up and developing competitive teams in both slots. It was planned as a win-win for both clubs. Not quite a devious as you make it seem. I agree, the players got screwed and this is what it should all be about... the players. But NTH leadership can only look in the mirror as to where to lay the blame. It shouldn't be at CF for having 2 teams and it shouldn't be on ECNL for shunning a club that shunned them... twice from what I understand. To your point on responsibility of holding two teams in ECNL then, how else can you justify awarding CF a 2nd ECNL spot and not give one to SSA or another Georgia club? How is that good for game? Second, TH kept applying for years to ECNL before all that, so not sure who shunned whom first. Most importantly, agree that unfortunately the players paid the price and that's what bothers me the most. Honestly, did it bother you before DA collapsed that CF had 2 teams? Honestly? Probably not. Now, you want to have them give up a spot for TH? That's not how it works. CF committed to ECNL when DA was threatening their viability and was rewarded with a second spot. CF could hold down a 2nd slot on their own ( just like Tophat did when they had two), but they felt they wanted to increase their strength by partnering with SSA... SSA wanted a path for the top players to go so they could keep their overall program strong. Win-Win. Now, that the top talent may be seeing CF as a better landing spot, they should be even more capable of filling that second slot. When TH had 2 slots, did you feel you they should have given one up of those slots for SSA like you mentioned? Again, Probably not. It is, what it is... NTH leadership backed the wrong horse and lost. They are suffering the effects of it. Unfortunately, so are the kids and parents through no fault of their own. Be mad at TH for being Richards about it. |
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Post by baller84 on May 23, 2020 22:33:11 GMT -5
To your point on responsibility of holding two teams in ECNL then, how else can you justify awarding CF a 2nd ECNL spot and not give one to SSA or another Georgia club? How is that good for game? Second, TH kept applying for years to ECNL before all that, so not sure who shunned whom first. Most importantly, agree that unfortunately the players paid the price and that's what bothers me the most. Honestly, did it bother you before DA collapsed that CF had 2 teams? Honestly? Probably not. Now, you want to have them give up a spot for TH? That's not how it works. CF committed to ECNL when DA was threatening their viability and was rewarded with a second spot. CF could hold down a 2nd slot on their own ( just like Tophat did when they had two), but they felt they wanted to increase their strength by partnering with SSA... SSA wanted a path for the top players to go so they could keep their overall program strong. Win-Win. Now, that the top talent may be seeing CF as a better landing spot, they should be even more capable of filling that second slot. When TH had 2 slots, did you feel you they should have given one up of those slots for SSA like you mentioned? Again, Probably not. It is, what it is... NTH leadership backed the wrong horse and lost. They are suffering the effects of it. Unfortunately, so are the kids and parents through no fault of their own. Be mad at TH for being Richards about it. Yes it did. I never said TH having 2 spots in same league before another club gets one was right. And seriously, calling DA decision which was supported by the National Coaching Staff backing the wrong horse is grossly unfair. Two things bother me: 1) kids getting screwed, 2) the ridiculous ECNL decisions. I hope MLS/USYS solve this mess once and for all. |
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Post by rifle on May 23, 2020 22:36:51 GMT -5
Situations like this are the reason why I don't like entitlement leagues in general. I think every club, team, etc. should be on the same playing field like they were 15 years ago. Every team in every age had an opportunity to earn its way to the highest level. Some may argue that this promotes a win at all cost attitude from coaches and clubs, but most of them have that attitude anyway, despite what they tell you or what their club philosophy is. It's not just Tophat that is locked out of self christened elite leagues - there are lots of clubs looking in from the outside. Bingo. It’s not about the kids... or even about money. Club based leagues aren’t a guarantee of quality. They’re a guarantee of control. |
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Post by atlutd17 on May 23, 2020 23:01:50 GMT -5
There is something seriously wrong with the whole youth soccer landscape.
Will take time and can only hope the MLS and USYS will finally fix this mess.
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Post by SoccerMom on May 24, 2020 0:18:30 GMT -5
There is something seriously wrong with the whole youth soccer landscape. Will take time and can only hope the MLS and USYS will finally fix this mess. Fix what? MLS academy is only for boys, it's only u13 & u14 and NASATH already declined it. Are you suggesting TH goes back to USYS league? So drop GAL, DPL & SCCL and go back to GA Soccer and work their way back in? Or would you just like a spot to be given to them |
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Post by soccergurl on May 24, 2020 1:28:17 GMT -5
Rumors are flying about the 07 Girls abandoning ship and heading for ECNL programs. Is it happening at other age groups? Without ECNL can Tophat recruit the Top talent? Will Tophat promote from within? Are those girls from 2nd and 3rd teams that could supposedly beat most clubs 1st teams really that talented? Or will Tophat go for other clubs 1st team leftovers? Is Tophat planning just for what is best for next year or what is best for the club in 5-10 years? Stay tuned and find out in the next exciting episode of "As the Tophat World Turns." |sadly not a rumor| |2007 top team decimated| |CF major beneficiary| |CF families not happy| |no loyalty to CF families| |
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Post by soccergurl on May 24, 2020 1:35:17 GMT -5
And why travel to begin with when you can have enough 6 solid clubs in Georgia? The unjust instability and stress this has caused to so many on top of the pandemic is ridiculous. It's not ok for NTH (that was competing just fine in ECNL with its 2nd team) to have ECNL or maybe a Georgia club outside metro Atlanta, yet is perfectly ok for CF to have 2. But that was ECNL's way to gain the upper hand on USDA. And what's funny is CF turned around and used that 2nd ECNL spot as leverage with ... SSA whose players and staff play ECNL using CF name and uniforms for two years now. Unbelievable yet as real as it gets. |ussf vs ecnl war| |tophat chooses DA| |CF chooses ECNL| |CF leverages all-in, gets 2 teams| |tophat poo poo ecnl| |ECNL wins, ussf losers| |now tophat wants poo poo ecnl| |toooo late| |to the victor goes the spoils| |
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Post by rifle on May 24, 2020 8:01:35 GMT -5
There is something seriously wrong with the whole youth soccer landscape. Will take time and can only hope the MLS and USYS will finally fix this mess. A paper dog chasing and asbestos cat through hell has a better chance than MLS fixing youth soccer. |
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Post by gunner on May 24, 2020 8:12:55 GMT -5
At least 7 tophat DA 07 girls have already signed with Concorde. Five players from the 05 DA, and six from the 04 DA left the club to various locations. |
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Post by oldhat on May 24, 2020 8:17:04 GMT -5
Rumors are only 4 girls are staying. Two field players that use to play at NTH North and the two keepers. All of the Buckhead players are leaving. All of the players that came from other clubs are leaving. I guess the Buckhead players and imports understood that Tophat would show no loyalty to them in the future and so they showed no loyalty back to Tophat. Totally understandable. Here is thing. Other clubs are doing the same thing now. They are taking these ex-Tophat players and showing no loyalty to their own players. Could Tophat use this as an opportunity to differentiate themselves from other clubs in a new way and show some loyalty to players at their own club?
There was a 07 Gold team at North the year before last. They were not as technical or big as the 07 Buckhead Gold, but they were a very good team. They all enjoyed playing with and for each other. The were unselfish and played as a team. They even beat the Buckhead team in the finals of a tournament 4-1 after losing to them 3-0 earlier in the same tournament. They would beat all of teams with the players that Tophat is going to look at now. All of the North girls are still in the club on the top three teams, except for 2. They left because they had ECNL offers and had to commit before Tophat had made up their mind and sent out offers. All of those girls would play together again in a heart beat. But instead of looking within......
Tophat could become the club that everyone fights to get into early and becomes known for developing their own great talent. They have great coaches and facilities. But I think it will come down to the fact that when you look at a new player you see possibility and potential. When you look at a player you know you tend to see flaws or limitations.
Tophat has some new potential as a club, but Tophat will probably keep trying the same thing it is known for now.
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Post by Goalkeeper Dad on May 24, 2020 8:19:55 GMT -5
At least 7 tophat DA 07 girls have already signed with Concorde. Five players from the 05 DA, and six from the 04 DA left the club to various locations. In life people will always move and always think things are better elsewhere. Now with these players moving time to remember, next in line let's go. TOPHAT WILL NOT FAIL. WE WILL STEP UP AND WISH THE GIRLS WHO LEFT BEST OF LUCK |
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Post by Futsal Gawdess on May 24, 2020 8:27:28 GMT -5
Every year, there is the normal depletion and elevation of players on the top team at any club. Most expected some moves from many clubs with the loss of GDA and the creation of new leagues. So far, this is what I know of some of the movements with NTH. Do you think this is a normal ebb n flow or something more and why?
2003 - Unknown
2004 - 6
2005 - 5
2006 - Unknown
2007 - 5, no 8, wait 11, you know what, maybe whole team 🤦♂️
2008 - 5
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Post by gunner on May 24, 2020 8:27:29 GMT -5
Five players from the 05 DA, and six from the 04 DA left the club to various locations. In life people will always move and always think things are better elsewhere. Now with these players moving time to remember, next in line let's go. TOPHAT WILL NOT FAIL. WE WILL STEP UP AND WISH THE GIRLS WHO LEFT BEST OF LUCK I don't really know the girls but I talk with some of the parents and it seem more about location and opportunity than the failure of Tophat. To each their own not every team fits. every player especially when the coaches don't know the players. |
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Post by Goalkeeper Dad on May 24, 2020 8:36:10 GMT -5
In life people will always move and always think things are better elsewhere. Now with these players moving time to remember, next in line let's go. TOPHAT WILL NOT FAIL. WE WILL STEP UP AND WISH THE GIRLS WHO LEFT BEST OF LUCK I don't really know the girls but I talk some of the parents and it seem more about location and opportunity than the failure of Tophat. To each there own not every team fits. every player especially when the coaches don't know the players. Gunner I don't know all the girls also but all I know is all the people are jumping off the bandwagon and all we have are the girls that will be wearing the Navy and Gold and we will rise again From what I am hearing we are still are having girls call Tophat because they know what it means to wear NAVY AND GOLD...Next girl up |
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Post by oldhat on May 24, 2020 8:49:06 GMT -5
Rumors are only 4 girls are staying. Two field players that use to play at NTH North and the two keepers. All of the Buckhead players are leaving. All of the players that came from other clubs are leaving. I guess the Buckhead players and imports understood that Tophat would show no loyalty to them in the future and so they showed no loyalty back to Tophat. Totally understandable. Here is thing. Other clubs are doing the same thing now. They are taking these ex-Tophat players and showing no loyalty to their own players. Could Tophat use this as an opportunity to differentiate themselves from other clubs in a new way and show some loyalty to players at their own club?
There was a 07 Gold team at North the year before last. They were not as technical or big as the 07 Buckhead Gold, but they were a very good team. They all enjoyed playing with and for each other. The were unselfish and played as a team. They even beat the Buckhead team in the finals of a tournament 4-1 after losing to them 3-0 earlier in the same tournament. They would beat all of teams with the players that Tophat is going to look at now. All of the North girls are still in the club on the top three teams, except for 2. They left because they had ECNL offers and had to commit before Tophat had made up their mind and sent out offers. All of those girls would play together again in a heart beat. But instead of looking within......
Tophat could become the club that everyone fights to get into early and becomes known for developing their own great talent. They have great coaches and facilities. But I think it will come down to the fact that when you look at a new player you see possibility and potential. When you look at a player you know you tend to see flaws or limitations.
Tophat has some new potential as a club, but Tophat will probably keep trying the same thing it is known for now.
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