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Post by BubbleDad on Jun 16, 2020 11:25:05 GMT -5
www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/discriminationThis is exactly what they're fighting against. Ask your gay/lesbian/non-white friends why they think they're being discriminated against and possibly you'll learn something. Then when someone says Happy Holidays instead of Merry Christmas try to remember All Holidays Matter and it's not a war against your faith or religion because another person doesn't believe the same things you do. Business can serve someone and treat them right and it's ok if they do not personally believe in what they're doing. Yep and the discrimination aspect is overblown and a strawman when you are talking about the LGBTQ community. They amplify the few here and there issues and make it sound like they are the norm. I don't know of a single business that discriminates against the LGBTQ community, not even the whipping boy for the LGBTQ movement Chickfila that has employees and managers that are gay and treats everyone that enters their doors as equal as do 99% of all businesses. At this point they have every right that a heterosexual has in every way. Any going after Christian businesses at this point is just a ploy to destroy those businesses. Period. There really isn't a leg for them to stand on at this point as the ones they protest don't even discriminate. There are great LGBTQ people and I know and am even related to a few. Most don't act like this. The problem is the movement like all movements have been hijacked by radicals. Just like BLM leadership are full of radicals as well. Those radicals give movements bad names, just as the radicals in the Christian faith gave Christians a bad name or Islamic Terrorists give all Muslims a bad name. The people in these movements need to police their own to keep the radicals from defining them and thus making them lose support. there have been no looters / attackers that I've seen on either fox nor CNN that said they are looting / destroying in the name of the organization black lives matter. Just because someone shouts black lives matter doesn't mean that they're necessarily affiliated with the organization ... it is that they really are only saying that black lives matter. The black lives matter organization is a peaceful organization. The phrase black lives matter can be said by anyone who believes it peacefully or violently. |
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Post by slickdaddy96 on Jun 16, 2020 12:19:32 GMT -5
Yep and the discrimination aspect is overblown and a strawman when you are talking about the LGBTQ community. They amplify the few here and there issues and make it sound like they are the norm. I don't know of a single business that discriminates against the LGBTQ community, not even the whipping boy for the LGBTQ movement Chickfila that has employees and managers that are gay and treats everyone that enters their doors as equal as do 99% of all businesses. At this point they have every right that a heterosexual has in every way. Any going after Christian businesses at this point is just a ploy to destroy those businesses. Period. There really isn't a leg for them to stand on at this point as the ones they protest don't even discriminate. There are great LGBTQ people and I know and am even related to a few. Most don't act like this. The problem is the movement like all movements have been hijacked by radicals. Just like BLM leadership are full of radicals as well. Those radicals give movements bad names, just as the radicals in the Christian faith gave Christians a bad name or Islamic Terrorists give all Muslims a bad name. The people in these movements need to police their own to keep the radicals from defining them and thus making them lose support. there have been no looters / attackers that I've seen on either fox nor CNN that said they are looting / destroying in the name of the organization black lives matter. Just because someone shouts black lives matter doesn't mean that they're necessarily affiliated with the organization ... it is that they really are only saying that black lives matter. The black lives matter organization is a peaceful organization. The phrase black lives matter can be said by anyone who believes it peacefully or violently. I'm sorry you are wrong on BLM. You might want to read their own words that their own social media accounts affiliated with them have said. Read this article. www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2020/06/12/make-no-mistake-blm-radical-neo-marxist-political-movement/And if that is behind a paywall here is the same article below for free. headtopics.com/uk/make-no-mistake-blm-is-a-radical-neo-marxist-political-movement-13637043 |
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Post by mistergrinch on Jun 16, 2020 13:15:46 GMT -5
there have been no looters / attackers that I've seen on either fox nor CNN that said they are looting / destroying in the name of the organization black lives matter. Just because someone shouts black lives matter doesn't mean that they're necessarily affiliated with the organization ... it is that they really are only saying that black lives matter. The black lives matter organization is a peaceful organization. The phrase black lives matter can be said by anyone who believes it peacefully or violently. I'm sorry you are wrong on BLM. You might want to read their own words that their own social media accounts affiliated with them have said. Read this article. www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2020/06/12/make-no-mistake-blm-radical-neo-marxist-political-movement/And if that is behind a paywall here is the same article below for free. headtopics.com/uk/make-no-mistake-blm-is-a-radical-neo-marxist-political-movement-13637043So - I read that article.. and while a fascinating op-ed piece, it has literally zero source material. It starts with 'don't take my word, take theirs'.. then has literally one 4-word phrase of their words and spends the rest of the article using the author's words and none sourced from BLM. |
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Post by bogan on Jun 16, 2020 13:21:08 GMT -5
Can you guys hold up for a minute? I need to go to the lobby and get some more popcorn 🍿.
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Post by BubbleDad on Jun 16, 2020 13:30:18 GMT -5
So - I read that article.. and while a fascinating op-ed piece, it has literally zero source material. It starts with 'don't take my word, take theirs'.. then has literally one 4-word phrase of their words and spends the rest of the article using the author's words and none sourced from BLM. that article lost me at talking about BLM is a radical left organization. Anytime someone is starting to mention or categorize thoughts as left or right and liberal or conservative you let me know that they are on the opposite side of the side they are attacking. |
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Post by mistergrinch on Jun 16, 2020 14:58:12 GMT -5
So - I read that article.. and while a fascinating op-ed piece, it has literally zero source material. It starts with 'don't take my word, take theirs'.. then has literally one 4-word phrase of their words and spends the rest of the article using the author's words and none sourced from BLM. that article lost me at talking about BLM is a radical left organization. Anytime someone is starting to mention or categorize thoughts as left or right and liberal or conservative you let me know that they are on the opposite side of the side they are attacking. now that's just what I'd expect a liberal.. er.. conservative.. to say. |
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Post by baller84 on Jun 16, 2020 15:51:40 GMT -5
What message will we send with half stadium kneeling? The issue is real. The flag is the flag too, and I'm concerned for the unintended consequences and our global image as a nation.
This is gone too far, it's uncomfortable, awkward and it's gotten global attention. If we're going to be this split after what's happened, why play the National Anthem for domestic matches?
Then again playing the Anthems is mandatory for FIFA international matches and we don't want to open Pandora's box. Any kneeling in front of an international audience can spiral different meanings.
There is no quick fix or quick healing, but, we must resolve the issue or at least come to some consensus, before we go there.
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Post by soccernotfootball on Jun 16, 2020 16:17:35 GMT -5
Who gives a shiz what the international audience thinks? They should be so lucky as to have the freedoms and rights Americans do...
And if the results of this poll are correct, about half taking it need to go back and take a high school civics course. The opinion that it is disrespectful does not matter one bit. It is a legal form of peaceful protest under the First Amendment. Period.
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Post by baller84 on Jun 16, 2020 16:30:35 GMT -5
Who gives a shiz what the international audience thinks? They should be so lucky as to have the freedoms and rights Americans do... And if the results of this poll are correct, about half taking it need to go back and take a high school civics course. The opinion that it is disrespectful does not matter one bit. It is a legal form of peaceful protest under the First Amendment. Period. I do because we are not like any other country. Being Americans separates us from the rest. As global leaders and innovators, the world's opinion does matter when they look up to us to lead by example. In everything. The right way. |
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Post by Keeper on Jun 16, 2020 16:36:31 GMT -5
Who gives a shiz what the international audience thinks? They should be so lucky as to have the freedoms and rights Americans do... And if the results of this poll are correct, about half taking it need to go back and take a high school civics course. The opinion that it is disrespectful does not matter one bit. It is a legal form of peaceful protest under the First Amendment. Period. I do because we are not like any other country. Being Americans separates us from the rest. As global leaders and innovators, the world's opinion does matter when they look up to us to lead by example. In everything. The right way. America is already a joke in the eyes of the first world countries, so what’s the difference. Why should we care how we look to others? Why should we be allowed to try and police the world when we have a whole shizat ton more problems then a lot of other countries. We need to focus on fixing our country to where everyone is actually treated as an equal, unlike now where a diminishing majority tries to dictate to the minorities. |
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Post by soccernotfootball on Jun 16, 2020 17:19:43 GMT -5
Who gives a shiz what the international audience thinks? They should be so lucky as to have the freedoms and rights Americans do... And if the results of this poll are correct, about half taking it need to go back and take a high school civics course. The opinion that it is disrespectful does not matter one bit. It is a legal form of peaceful protest under the First Amendment. Period. I do because we are not like any other country. Being Americans separates us from the rest. As global leaders and innovators, the world's opinion does matter when they look up to us to lead by example. In everything. The right way. I agree - we are global leaders and innovators and lead by example. One of those examples being the right to hold peaceful protest under the First Amendment. I don't agree with kneeling - but I agree with the First Amendment and will defend others right to protest. |
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Post by randomparent on Jun 16, 2020 21:04:11 GMT -5
Why can't we just have a forum about Georgia soccer? It's like everyone is so mad that there is no one left to argue with on Facebook because everyone has unfollowed everyone they need to run to a soccer message board, Nextdoor, etc. and spew their anger.
My recommendation is to turn off cable news, they have become master manipulators into taking you from one urgent crisis to another - that is true for both liberal and conservative outlets. When you respond and post online you all want people to hear you but you don't want to listen.
Enjoy your family, make the most of your life, make more deposits with people than you take, and realize that there has probably never been a time in human history where things were better than they are today (even with the imperfect world we live in).
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Post by slickdaddy96 on Jun 17, 2020 6:46:44 GMT -5
Why can't we just have a forum about Georgia soccer? It's like everyone is so mad that there is no one left to argue with on Facebook because everyone has unfollowed everyone they need to run to a soccer message board, Nextdoor, etc. and spew their anger. My recommendation is to turn off cable news, they have become master manipulators into taking you from one urgent crisis to another - that is true for both liberal and conservative outlets. When you respond and post online you all want people to hear you but you don't want to listen. Enjoy your family, make the most of your life, make more deposits with people than you take, and realize that there has probably never been a time in human history where things were better than they are today (even with the imperfect world we live in). I think that its time for this group to have a sub-group called "Off-Topic" for people that do want to discuss other things so we don't have to constantly hear the whining and complaining from folks that don't want to see it.  Quit stifling our 1st Amendment rights!  |
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Post by forsythsd on Jun 17, 2020 9:38:04 GMT -5
It is a legal form of peaceful protest under the First Amendment. Period. Sure, you're free to kneel in your front yard during your own time, but not at work, unless your boss allows it. Would your boss allow you to protest at work in a controversial manner that would likely alienate some clients? Because that's what you're saying you have the 1A right to do. Clearly this is not true. And again I ask, since nobody replied (not counting insults): if one player is allowed to protest police brutality or racism while in uniform at a game, can others protest illegal immigration or abortion or gun restrictions or green house gasses or rainforest destruction or the ivory trade or cat juggling or [...] ? |
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Post by atlfutboldad on Jun 17, 2020 10:06:58 GMT -5
And again I ask, since nobody replied (not counting insults): if one player is allowed to protest police brutality or racism while in uniform at a game, can others protest illegal immigration or abortion or gun restrictions or green house gasses or rainforest destruction or the ivory trade or cat juggling or [...] ? I've heard about this, cat juggling! Cat jugglers are indeed the worst.
But no, they would not be allowed to protest such other things. See Jaelene Hinkle.
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Post by kidsocceruber on Jun 17, 2020 11:10:05 GMT -5
This is a moot point since 1 - The NFL and other leagues are "seeing the light/acquiesced/whatever you want to call it" since they're not going to stop it and 2 - The mention of doing it at your work/office does not have a national spotlight, so unless it's the actual conditions you're under at work I bet then you'd get a discussion about it with management(positive or negative) and it would likely suit its purpose.
Whether you agree with the protests or not, the US is at a boiling point and will continue to bubble up until something changes or something worse happens.
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Post by baller84 on Jun 17, 2020 14:27:54 GMT -5
What do you think of that then?
LAFC has launched an initiative to recognize Juneteenth as a federal holiday in the United States, with a Change.org petition that has a goal of reaching 100,000 signatures.
Juneteenth is known as the anniversary of the official end of slavery, celebrated every year on June 19 — the date Major General Gordon Granger of the Union Army informed slaves after landing in Galveston, Texas that the Civil War had ended and slavery had been abolished.
The holiday is currently recognized in 47 of the 50 US states, with the club encouraging fans to sign the petition to have the date established as a federal holiday.
"The launch of the Juneteenth petitions is the first of many upcoming initiatives LAFC is pledging to take on in its commitment to foster change," the club said in a Tuesday release. "The Club stands firmly in solidarity with the Black Community against all acts of racism, hatred and prejudice. LAFC will continue to support, promote equality and use their collective voice against all social injustice.
Sign the petition here.
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Post by soccernotfootball on Jun 17, 2020 15:53:13 GMT -5
It is a legal form of peaceful protest under the First Amendment. Period. Sure, you're free to kneel in your front yard during your own time, but not at work, unless your boss allows it. Would your boss allow you to protest at work in a controversial manner that would likely alienate some clients? Because that's what you're saying you have the 1A right to do. Clearly this is not true. And again I ask, since nobody replied (not counting insults): if one player is allowed to protest police brutality or racism while in uniform at a game, can others protest illegal immigration or abortion or gun restrictions or green house gasses or rainforest destruction or the ivory trade or cat juggling or [...] ? Agreed - if your employer feels that the players’ protest is impacting their business, they will be within their rights to remove a player. But since we're talking about the National Team and not Joe's Hardware Store and Feather Emporium - it may be a bad look to remove an American player for practicing a right protected under the First Amendment. I would think that would impact their business more. |
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Post by SoccerMom on Jun 17, 2020 18:21:36 GMT -5
Why can't we just have a forum about Georgia soccer? It's like everyone is so mad that there is no one left to argue with on Facebook because everyone has unfollowed everyone they need to run to a soccer message board, Nextdoor, etc. and spew their anger. My recommendation is to turn off cable news, they have become master manipulators into taking you from one urgent crisis to another - that is true for both liberal and conservative outlets. When you respond and post online you all want people to hear you but you don't want to listen. Enjoy your family, make the most of your life, make more deposits with people than you take, and realize that there has probably never been a time in human history where things were better than they are today (even with the imperfect world we live in). I think that its time for this group to have a sub-group called "Off-Topic" for people that do want to discuss other things so we don't have to constantly hear the whining and complaining from folks that don't want to see it. Quit stifling our 1st Amendment rights! If they don't want to read it.... don't click on it 😂😂 (theres a few threads I don't click on based on titles...like which XX team is better 🙄😴 I don't see an issue with people's discussions and seeing other people's points of views. If we all agreed on everything it would be a pretty boring world |
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Post by soccerlegacy on Jun 17, 2020 23:38:08 GMT -5
I would suggest locking this thread. Not surprisingly people are starting to get a little out of hand. Please do not lock this thread. This is one of the problems we, as a nation, are currently facing... The unwillingness to listen to the other sides' argument or opinion. I might not agree with the other side (mind you I haven't even taken a side on this thread, I only read through it), but canceling free debate, discussion, or even outrage... is what will cause even further destruction of the greatest free nation on earth. "Cancel Culture" is not is not the answer. Not learning from history or worse, rewriting history is not the answer... hearing opposing views, whether you agree with them or not, is the answer. Because eventually, after the initial shock wears off, and we are little more calm, we can begin to look at things from another point of view. I'm not saying that you will necessarily change someone's mind, but they might begin to have a bit of a different perspective on the given topic and that can lead to empathy.... and empathy can lead to healing. It is our country's 1st amendment of free speech that grants us this right, and yes, it IS a right! ... one that we might regret being taken away by the "cancel culture" if the roles are ever reversed and they start coming after you. |
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Post by atlfutboldad on Jun 18, 2020 0:45:49 GMT -5
Its a political issue, like socialized medicine or the 2nd amendment. People will never agree with the other side. Political parties form largely on personality types... and they will not see common ground.
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Post by slickdaddy96 on Jun 18, 2020 6:57:33 GMT -5
Its a political issue, like socialized medicine or the 2nd amendment. People will never agree with the other side. Political parties form largely on personality types... and they will not see common ground. Yep and as an admitted fiscal conservative but more libertarian on my social ideas, I long for the days where both parties were willing to compromise and that both parties wanted to work for the good of the country as it was founded. Now its both sides going completely polar opposite of each other with one side wanting to tear down the country in the way it was founded because it isn't a "good country" and rebuild it in some globalist utopian society that would never work, and the other side reacting to that and going far right due to it. Once both parties had majority members that wanted what was best for the country as founded but they just had different ideas on how to achieve that but they compromised to work through it. Now it seems one party shifted so far polar that I don't believe there are many members left in this party in active political positions that are willing to even hear the other side anymore. They always need full capitulation or it is never "enough", and they have said so much rhetoric to their base of voters that I don't believe that they can ever go back to moderate because their voters would revolt. So they made their own bed on that issue. I do long for the 80's and hell even the 90's where compromise did indeed happen all the time and things got done. |
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Post by mistergrinch on Jun 18, 2020 9:29:45 GMT -5
Its a political issue, like socialized medicine or the 2nd amendment. People will never agree with the other side. Political parties form largely on personality types... and they will not see common ground. Yep and as an admitted fiscal conservative but more libertarian on my social ideas, I long for the days where both parties were willing to compromise and that both parties wanted to work for the good of the country as it was founded. Now its both sides going completely polar opposite of each other with one side wanting to tear down the country in the way it was founded because it isn't a "good country" and rebuild it in some globalist utopian society that would never work, and the other side reacting to that and going far right due to it. Once both parties had majority members that wanted what was best for the country as founded but they just had different ideas on how to achieve that but they compromised to work through it. Now it seems one party shifted so far polar that I don't believe there are many members left in this party in active political positions that are willing to even hear the other side anymore. They always need full capitulation or it is never "enough", and they have said so much rhetoric to their base of voters that I don't believe that they can ever go back to moderate because their voters would revolt. So they made their own bed on that issue.
I do long for the 80's and hell even the 90's where compromise did indeed happen all the time and things got done.
I fully agree here.. though I think we may be blame different parties for starting it. I'm sure it can be debated, but I always kind of trace it back to Gingrich as the one who really kicked off the partisan blocking of legislation. I didn't think so at the time, but looking back that seems to be around where it started to get heavy.
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Post by baller84 on Jun 18, 2020 10:44:25 GMT -5
Yep and as an admitted fiscal conservative but more libertarian on my social ideas, I long for the days where both parties were willing to compromise and that both parties wanted to work for the good of the country as it was founded. Now its both sides going completely polar opposite of each other with one side wanting to tear down the country in the way it was founded because it isn't a "good country" and rebuild it in some globalist utopian society that would never work, and the other side reacting to that and going far right due to it. Once both parties had majority members that wanted what was best for the country as founded but they just had different ideas on how to achieve that but they compromised to work through it. Now it seems one party shifted so far polar that I don't believe there are many members left in this party in active political positions that are willing to even hear the other side anymore. They always need full capitulation or it is never "enough", and they have said so much rhetoric to their base of voters that I don't believe that they can ever go back to moderate because their voters would revolt. So they made their own bed on that issue.
I do long for the 80's and hell even the 90's where compromise did indeed happen all the time and things got done.
I fully agree here.. though I think we may be blame different parties for starting it. I'm sure it can be debated, but I always kind of trace it back to Gingrich as the one who really kicked off the partisan blocking of legislation. I didn't think so at the time, but looking back that seems to be around where it started to get heavy.
That's correct. Unfortunately whether is politics, mentality, or soccer, we have become as un-united as polar opposites. It's the mildest word I can think to express today's reality. How did we get here? |
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Post by atlfutboldad on Jun 18, 2020 11:29:25 GMT -5
I could write a lot on this but will spare you. I blame 3 things, social media the last of them. We had many prophets in the 40s, 50s, 60s and 70s...we just didn't listen. That said, western civilization is eating itself from within and will decline.
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Post by mistergrinch on Jun 18, 2020 14:00:58 GMT -5
I could write a lot on this but will spare you. I blame 3 things, social media the last of them. We had many prophets in the 40s, 50s, 60s and 70s...we just didn't listen. That said, western civilization is eating itself from within and will decline. and before social media - the 24hr news cycle was a big kick over the cliff. Then the deregulation of media ownership.. a whole bunch of things combined to make infotainment the norm.
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Post by atlfutboldad on Jun 18, 2020 14:09:04 GMT -5
Remember how much discussion was put into the coverage of OJ, Anna Nicole Smith, Natalee Holloway and Madeleine McCann? It was (and is) ridiculous.
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Post by BubbleDad on Jun 18, 2020 14:35:45 GMT -5
I think America is an okay place. Most of those who say it is a great place are not people of color.
People of color in America have been made ashamed to stay true to the ways of their native country or culture. You have to assimilate in order for America to be great for you and if you don't it can downgrade to being okay or bad to be in America.
American athletes of color carry all of these pluses and minuses. You can be black, but don't rock cornrows or locks. Not until recently has that been accepted within corporate or mainstream positions outside of the music industry. I've been encouraged to read the 40 million dollar slave but haven't gotten around to it.
Had a conference call today and a diversity and inclusion professional was invited. She spoke about the different images in America that are super racist, but due to culture we have accepted them as the norm. Within our history, the only times it is acceptable to display cultural differences is when white people can make money off of it and in most cases the person or culture that they are mocking had no input on what is being represented.
Lil Wayne went on the Skip and Shannon show and had the nerve to say that he had never experienced racism before without thinking hey I grew up in the projects which was filled with 99.9% of folks of African ancestry and didn't consider that to be systemic racism. We are so entrenched in racism it's ridiculous. Folks who are victims of it have been breathing it so much and don't realize that it is choking them.
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Post by rudy on Jun 18, 2020 17:38:16 GMT -5
I must disagree about assimilation. I am an American of German descent. My ancestors were thrown out of two countries in 1870s when the immigrated to the US. The family spoke German but would never speak it outside of the house. They worked hard to learn English. During WW I, my grandfather served and went back to Europe where his family came from. My father served in WW II. After WW II he began working for $4 I'm the third generation. Our family gave up their German traditions, language and frankly have no ties remaining. We did so to assimilate and become Americans. I can proudly say I'm a first generation college graduate.
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Post by winning on Jun 18, 2020 18:00:09 GMT -5
I think America is an okay place. Most of those who say it is a great place are not people of color. People of color in America have been made ashamed to stay true to the ways of their native country or culture. You have to assimilate in order for America to be great for you and if you don't it can downgrade to being okay or bad to be in America. American athletes of color carry all of these pluses and minuses. You can be black, but don't rock cornrows or locks. Not until recently has that been accepted within corporate or mainstream positions outside of the music industry. I've been encouraged to read the 40 million dollar slave but haven't gotten around to it. Had a conference call today and a diversity and inclusion professional was invited. She spoke about the different images in America that are super racist, but due to culture we have accepted them as the norm. Within our history, the only times it is acceptable to display cultural differences is when white people can make money off of it and in most cases the person or culture that they are mocking had no input on what is being represented. Lil Wayne went on the Skip and Shannon show and had the nerve to say that he had never experienced racism before without thinking hey I grew up in the projects which was filled with 99.9% of folks of African ancestry and didn't consider that to be systemic racism. We are so entrenched in racism it's ridiculous. Folks who are victims of it have been breathing it so much and don't realize that it is choking them. I wholeheartedly agree, bubbledad!!! |
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