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Post by insideinfo on Jun 13, 2020 13:27:14 GMT -5
United States congressman Matt Gaetz (R-Fla.) introduced a bill Friday that would force U.S. Soccer players to stand during the playing of the national anthem
“I don’t like soccer enough, for the US to even have a soccer team"
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Post by atlfutboldad on Jun 13, 2020 13:36:42 GMT -5
Does USSF receive federal funding? If they do, they shouldn't. If they don't, the US congress should have no bearing on what players do or do not do during the anthem.
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Post by misssocceratl on Jun 13, 2020 13:40:10 GMT -5
Man, we sure do need another polarizing topic on this forum.
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Post by insideinfo on Jun 13, 2020 13:43:40 GMT -5
Does USSF receive federal funding? If they do, they shouldn't. If they don't, the US congress should have no bearing on what players do or do not do during the anthem. "The U.S. Olympic Committee, unlike its competitors around the world, does not receive funding from the federal government for its Olympic programs." So can they kneel during the Olympics? |
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Post by atlutd17 on Jun 13, 2020 13:45:48 GMT -5
Agreeing to disagree is the best you can hope for on a topic like this.
I vote for option #3.
I believe the MLS reserves the right whether to play the National Anthem or not.
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Post by insideinfo on Jun 13, 2020 13:54:21 GMT -5
How much funding do they provide? I haven't been able to find any information except something someone said but no sources
"I think, the United States receives no continuous financial assistance from the its government. As a non-profit organization, the US soccer is wholly dependent on private contributions and corporate sponsorship"
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Post by mightydawg on Jun 13, 2020 14:28:41 GMT -5
My vote is for who cares whether an athlete stands, sits, kneels, etc. I have been to plenty of Atlanta United, Braves, Georgia, and Falcons games where fans are talking, drinking, walking, eating, etc during the national anthem. I respect the troops, the flag and our country. However I admit that I am not always quite, standing at attention with my hand over my heart every time the national anthem is played. I would say most people fall in the same boat. Stop holding athletes to a different standard that you hold yourself. I go to the games to watch the athletes play their sport. Whatever they do before or after the game is their business, not mine and really does not affect my world.
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Post by atlfutboldad on Jun 13, 2020 14:31:48 GMT -5
Then they can kneel all they want. Should probably rebrand to ASF (American soccer federation) as they're not really associated with the US, just located here. They could even have their own theme song, US national anthem not needed. I suggest Zombie Nation.
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Post by Keeper on Jun 13, 2020 15:25:25 GMT -5
Then they can kneel all they want. Should probably rebrand to ASF (American soccer federation) as they're not really associated with the US, just located here. They could even have their own theme song, US national anthem not needed. I suggest Zombie Nation. If they became the American Soccer Fed then they’d be all to open up to all Americans finally! I’d suggest Green Day’s American Idiot as the new anthem. |
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Post by soccernotfootball on Jun 13, 2020 15:51:25 GMT -5
Who gives a shiz. It's become a fashion statement rather than anything more meaningful... but considering it's a constitutional right to exercise your first amendment - kneel away.
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Post by oraclesfriend on Jun 13, 2020 16:29:36 GMT -5
My vote is for who cares whether an athlete stands, sits, kneels, etc. I have been to plenty of Atlanta United, Braves, Georgia, and Falcons games where fans are talking, drinking, walking, eating, etc during the national anthem. I respect the troops, the flag and our country. However I admit that I am not always quite, standing at attention with my hand over my heart every time the national anthem is played. I would say most people fall in the same boat. Stop holding athletes to a different standard that you hold yourself. I go to the games to watch the athletes play their sport. Whatever they do before or after the game is their business, not mine and really does not affect my world. The thing with the hand over our hearts was not something anyone did when/where I grew up. We put our hands over our heart for the pledge of allegiance. We sang facing the flag for the anthem. If you are a man with a hat on, you took it off (never understood why your gender matters with regards to the hat thing, but that is another topic). |
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Post by baller84 on Jun 13, 2020 16:42:48 GMT -5
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Post by BubbleDad on Jun 13, 2020 18:10:11 GMT -5
When people finally realize that the American experience hasn't been the same for everyone, then they'll understand why folks are kneeling. "My grandfather's grandfather served in the military" is not a good excuse to criticize someone for kneeling or not taking off their hat or not standing. When your grandfather's grandfather was lynched after he gave and sacrificed his life for the United States after coming home from serving in the military, then come holler at me on how kneeling is disrespecting the flag.
It's nice to be cordial and loving to one another when we are side by side cheering our children on during a soccer game, but know there is a reason why soccer is so expensive to play... They are purposely trying to exclude people and that's why it is biting them in the ass and the men's team isn't as competitive as they should be on a global stage.
In Atlanta, you do find a more diverse distribution of wealth but this isn't the case in many cities. Take off your white washed shades and put on a transparent pair that allows you to see things from other people's perspectives. There are many people out here who work hard but just can't catch a break financially. The clubs need to advertise better that they offer financial aid.
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Post by oraclesfriend on Jun 13, 2020 18:33:51 GMT -5
bubbledadTotally agree on the financial aid advertisement. There was a young girl on my oldest's team at U9 and 10 who was very poor. She played on scholarship. She eventually played DA on scholarship. Unfortunately the club fees are not the only barrier. There are other financial outlays. The other problem is getting there.
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Post by atlutd17 on Jun 13, 2020 18:44:41 GMT -5
When people finally realize that the American experience hasn't been the same for everyone, then they'll understand why folks are kneeling. "My grandfather's grandfather served in the military" is not a good excuse to criticize someone for kneeling or not taking off their hat or not standing. When your grandfather's grandfather was lynched after he gave and sacrificed his life for the United States after coming home from serving in the military, then come holler at me on how kneeling is disrespecting the flag. It's nice to be cordial and loving to one another when we are side by side cheering our children on during a soccer game, but know there is a reason why soccer is so expensive to play... They are purposely trying to exclude people and that's why it is biting them in the ass and the men's team isn't as competitive as they should be on a global stage. In Atlanta, you do find a more diverse distribution of wealth but this isn't the case in many cities. Take off your white washed shades and put on a transparent pair that allows you to see things from other people's perspectives. There are many people out here who work hard but just can't catch a break financially. The clubs need to advertise better that they offer financial aid. Yep. I hear you bro loud and clear not to mention I've seen it. Wish I could do more. |
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Post by mistergrinch on Jun 13, 2020 18:55:48 GMT -5
United States congressman Matt Gaetz (R-Fla.) introduced a bill Friday that would force U.S. Soccer players to stand during the playing of the national anthem “I don’t like soccer enough, for the US to even have a soccer team" Unrelated.. but gaetz has one of the most punchable faces I've ever seen |
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Post by slickdaddy96 on Jun 13, 2020 19:12:12 GMT -5
Do they have the right to? Absolutely they do. Remember that your right of free speech and expression isn't consequence free though. I have the right to tell my boss off, or speak for the company even though I'm not in the position to do that. My company has the right to fire me as well. Cause and effect....
Should they kneel? If they are representing The United States in Competition then they should not. If they feel so strongly that the United States is a bad nation, then they should also resign their position on the team and playing for the team of the nation. Anything short of that is a publicity stunt and virtue signaling.
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Post by soccerloafer on Jun 13, 2020 20:08:59 GMT -5
They have a right to kneel. The coach should then have a right to bench them for eternity. And I have a right not to support kneelers. Except Kamala, that's how she got her start in SF.
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Post by rifle on Jun 13, 2020 20:19:06 GMT -5
I fully support a peaceful protest that doesn’t negatively impact others.. regardless of the venue... Constitutional rights don’t need conditions.
I do wish Kap and others would have moved their NFL protest to the televised (captains) coin toss ceremony to squash any suggestion it was about the national anthem, flag, military, etc - but I have a feeling somebody would still complain that the coin was disrespected.
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Post by BubbleDad on Jun 13, 2020 20:29:40 GMT -5
Do they have the right to? Absolutely they do. Remember that your right of free speech and expression isn't consequence free though. I have the right to tell my boss off, or speak for the company even though I'm not in the position to do that. My company has the right to fire me as well. Cause and effect.... Should they kneel? If they are representing The United States in Competition then they should not. If they feel so strongly that the United States is a bad nation, then they should also resign their position on the team and playing for the team of the nation. Anything short of that is a publicity stunt and virtue signaling. If your boss knew that you were there because you were living out a dream plus worked hard to get there and they are taking advantage of that, you wouldn't have a right to tell them off? Folks want to always look at X-Z without paying attention to A-W. Don't get me started on Corporate America and how they generally cheat their employees especially nowadays. |
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Post by BubbleDad on Jun 13, 2020 20:39:22 GMT -5
They have a right to kneel. The coach should then have a right to bench them for eternity. And I have a right not to support kneelers. Except Kamala, that's how she got her start in SF. Why are they kneeling and why don't you support them? This isn't an attack ... just really want to understand why you don't support kneelers. |
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Post by soccerloafer on Jun 14, 2020 7:57:42 GMT -5
They have a right to kneel. The coach should then have a right to bench them for eternity. And I have a right not to support kneelers. Except Kamala, that's how she got her start in SF. Why are they kneeling and why don't you support them? This isn't an attack ... just really want to understand why you don't support kneelers. Too much for this forum, but in general: 1. I believe in American Exceptionalism. I've been around the world (ok, not all, but enough). The US is the greatest society ever created. Is it perfect? No. Better than all the rest? By far. 2. I don't believe the National Teams are the right platform for protest. They are representing our country to the world. It is important that we show strength and solidarity. Our enemies look for cracks in our society and exploit them to turn us against each other. Just like family, we can have squabbles, but they don't need to play out in public. I'll keep it to that for now. |
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Post by BubbleDad on Jun 14, 2020 10:29:59 GMT -5
Why are they kneeling and why don't you support them? This isn't an attack ... just really want to understand why you don't support kneelers. Too much for this forum, but in general: 1. I believe in American Exceptionalism. I've been around the world (ok, not all, but enough). The US is the greatest society ever created. Is it perfect? No. Better than all the rest? By far. 2. I don't believe the National Teams are the right platform for protest. They are representing our country to the world. It is important that we show strength and solidarity. Our enemies look for cracks in our society and exploit them to turn us against each other. Just like family, we can have squabbles, but they don't need to play out in public. I'll keep it to that for now. Thank you for responding. It's not too much for this forum. Players are experiencing racial slurs in youth soccer by opponents already unfortunately. The pandemic has slowed the world down for it to see systemic racism up front and personal. We all want peace on Earth. |
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Post by slickdaddy96 on Jun 14, 2020 11:45:02 GMT -5
Do they have the right to? Absolutely they do. Remember that your right of free speech and expression isn't consequence free though. I have the right to tell my boss off, or speak for the company even though I'm not in the position to do that. My company has the right to fire me as well. Cause and effect.... Should they kneel? If they are representing The United States in Competition then they should not. If they feel so strongly that the United States is a bad nation, then they should also resign their position on the team and playing for the team of the nation. Anything short of that is a publicity stunt and virtue signaling. If your boss knew that you were there because you were living out a dream plus worked hard to get there and they are taking advantage of that, you wouldn't have a right to tell them off? Folks want to always look at X-Z without paying attention to A-W. Don't get me started on Corporate America and how they generally cheat their employees especially nowadays. My point is we do indeed have rights to do whatever we want unless it infringes on other people's rights. The fact that most people forget is those rights are not always consequence free. I disagree with the whole premise that the USSF is taking advantage of anyone nor the NFL or any other sports organization. The USSF pays a higher % to women than to men, and the whole equal pay arguments was bull which is why the courts threw it out. The women aren't getting taken advantage of, and if they think they are then they should quit the team. On the NFL, these people enter into contracts most worth millions upon millions of dollars and agree to the stipulations of that contract and rules. I enter into a contract with my employer, and sign that I will follow their terms of employment which includes limitation of free speech sometimes. If I break those rules I can be sanctioned or have my employment terminated. The truth is Kaep in my opinion is a fraud. He knew he was about to be benched permanently as a back up only, and made a statement to try to boost his image in some virtue signaling move. He walked away from $6 million +, so no one fired him. He could have sat the bench and made $6 million. He decided not to. I don't feel bad for him. I think he is fake. Just my opinion. No other team will give him a look at this point because his talent isn't more than a backup QB in the league at this point not to mention the media spectacle no team wants at this point. |
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Post by BubbleDad on Jun 14, 2020 12:03:25 GMT -5
The man just kneeled. There are dudes in the league who have beat women, shot at people and stole but still have jobs.
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Post by username on Jun 14, 2020 12:52:40 GMT -5
Why are they kneeling and why don't you support them? This isn't an attack ... just really want to understand why you don't support kneelers. Valid question, so let me explain why I believe this is a problem for many. You can support the issue, but that doesn’t require you to support an action. I could reverse your question and say why aren’t you supporting the military and those who have fought and died for this country? You could of course say, that isn’t my intent and I do support them, some would say your actions show otherwise as you disrespect them when you kneel at the anthem. So it creates a circular issue, most saying they support the military and ending racism, but disagree on the specific actions. You are putting people in a position based on how they were brought up to decide which they will show they support by a symbolic action. I wish leaders wanted to bring unity and find a compromise where you do not put people in that position. Have a strong unifying voice tell everyone to stand in honor during anthem to show respect for military and then everyone kneel during the coin toss, right before the game starts, or something else that doesn’t already have a meaning to so many. |
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Post by mistergrinch on Jun 14, 2020 16:07:19 GMT -5
I could reverse your question and say why aren’t you supporting the military and those who have fought and died for this country? Because that was never what the protests were about and anyone who says otherwise is being intellectually dishonest.
Because the anthem DOES NOT equate to "supporting the troops" and never has.
The anthem being tied to military support started when they paid millions to sports leagues to use it as a recruiting tool - pushing for the anthem to be a big show with flyovers and honor guards and flags.
NFL players weren't even required to be on the field during the anthem AT ALL until 2009, so please leave the revisionist history out of this.
Perhaps remembering back to the treatment of Tommie Smith and John Carlos - and realizing that 50 years later and we're still doing the same things.
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Post by Keeper on Jun 14, 2020 16:42:40 GMT -5
If your boss knew that you were there because you were living out a dream plus worked hard to get there and they are taking advantage of that, you wouldn't have a right to tell them off? Folks want to always look at X-Z without paying attention to A-W. Don't get me started on Corporate America and how they generally cheat their employees especially nowadays. My point is we do indeed have rights to do whatever we want unless it infringes on other people's rights. The fact that most people forget is those rights are not always consequence free. I disagree with the whole premise that the USSF is taking advantage of anyone nor the NFL or any other sports organization. The USSF pays a higher % to women than to men, and the whole equal pay arguments was bull which is why the courts threw it out. The women aren't getting taken advantage of, and if they think they are then they should quit the team. On the NFL, these people enter into contracts most worth millions upon millions of dollars and agree to the stipulations of that contract and rules. I enter into a contract with my employer, and sign that I will follow their terms of employment which includes limitation of free speech sometimes. If I break those rules I can be sanctioned or have my employment terminated. The truth is Kaep in my opinion is a fraud. He knew he was about to be benched permanently as a back up only, and made a statement to try to boost his image in some virtue signaling move. He walked away from $6 million +, so no one fired him. He could have sat the bench and made $6 million. He decided not to. I don't feel bad for him. I think he is fake. Just my opinion. No other team will give him a look at this point because his talent isn't more than a backup QB in the league at this point not to mention the media spectacle no team wants at this point. Well it’s good to know you know absolutely nothing about football, the Nfl and how good a QB actually is with those comments. |
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Post by kidsocceruber on Jun 14, 2020 17:48:17 GMT -5
We should stick to youth soccer arguments about who the better 05 girls team is. These are such useless conversations to have on the internet because nobody ever says "Oh you've changed my mind, thanks for setting me straight" and only serve to stir the pot and piss people off.
I deleted my rant because quite frankly it's just not worth it here.
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Post by insideinfo on Jun 14, 2020 18:56:29 GMT -5
For everyone that is saying that he is disrespecting the military, you do know where he got the idea to kneel from right?
Retired Army Green Beret Nate Boyer is the man who first convinced Colin Kaepernick to kneel during the national anthem.
BOYER: I thought - at that time I said, look, I think your point has definitely been made that everyone's listening. Like, let's make a plan of attack now. And, you know, let's work on action for it. But he said, you know, what I've committed to this, and - I'm not going to do it until I start to see these changes I want to see. And, you know, I respected that decision and opinion. And I thought kneeling - personally, so I don't speak for everybody, I don't speak for every veteran. I've been told that numerous times by many people. But I thought kneeling was more respectful, and I will say that being alongside his teammates was the biggest thing for me.
And, you know, people - in my opinions and in my experience, kneeling's never been in our history really seen as a disrespectful act. I mean, people kneel when they get knighted. You kneel to propose to your wife, and you take a knee to pray. And soldiers often take a knee in front of a fallen brother's grave to pay respects. So I thought, if anything, besides standing, that was the most respectful. But, of course, that's just my opinion
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